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Well college has flown by and I'm about to go in to my last year of Mechanical Engineering at Penn State Erie. I love the school and the classes that I'm taking and have done very well up to this point. The subject of graduate school has come up with a few of professors and all of them are urging me to continue my schooling. I enjoy Fluids/Thermal Sciences (Heat Transfer, Thermodynamics, Fluid Dynamics) and I am contemplating attending graduate school for aerodynamics

The idea of designing aerodynamic bits and pieces for racecars sounds awesome to me and I've been reading all the F1 technical developments and lurking around at F1Technical.net. I'm really not concerned about getting through the graduate school program. I've worked my butt off to learn as much as possible up to this point and it has paid off tremendously. I'm entering my final two semesters with a 3.86 cumulative GPA and a lowest grade of 2 B+'s (Calculus 1 Honors and Introductory Physics (bad teacher- learned the stuff later in Dynamics)) and two semesters with a 4.0. I've spent many weekends (Friday and Saturday nights included) working on homework and projects trying to do as well as possible.

But realistically, what are the chances of landing a racing related aerodynamics job? I'd like to design the bits and pieces but also be at the trackside during races. I'm not concerned about travel and I know about the long hours and crappy pay that most entry level race crewmen make (Steve Matchett's book about being a part of the F1 Pit Crew was an awesome read). I'd just like to get an idea of where I'm headed, what to expect, and if there's any pointers that you guys could offer. Also, I'm not expecting to work for a Formula 1 team (although that would be amazing).

Oh and I'm currently putting together a Spec E30 car (NASA) and am going to be starting HPDE's and track days next spring.

Also, sorry if this post comes across as arrogant. I'm not trying to be cocky or anything- merely just trying to show that I have the brain power to learn the stuff that's needed (I hope).

 

you will need experience in the racing industry and connections. Have you participated in FSAE? That would be something of a start.

Pratt and Miller offer internships during the summer in Detroit. I have a friend working for Penske as a shock engineer in IRL and he interned at Pratt and Miller but it took a lot of work (besides his internship) to get where he is now.

By the way I am in M.E. grad school right now. One thing to keep in mind is that you most likely won't be doing anything closely related to motorsports. There are several master's programs in the EU that are geared specifically towards motorsport. Cranfield comes to mind. Check out fsae.com for more on those. Hope that helped a little.

I would agree with Brian, FSAE is the best way to go. You won't get a starting job in motorsports without experience, and the best place to get the experience is FSAE.

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I am Chris Hammond.
Going2Colorado.com

I forgot to mention that I'm definitely looking at the school's FSAE program as one of the deciding factors since graduate students can also work on the car. I actually tried to create some interest in getting an FSAE program together at Penn State Erie but nothing ever materialized out of it.

One of the schools' car had tons of wings and stuff on it. I can't find the car right now that I'm talking about but I might look into whether or not those were really designed- if they were then that might be a decent school to look at depending on the actual graduate program itself.

http://img157.imageshack.us/img157/2279/img03845oa.jpg

^^^ That's kind of what I'm talking about but not the car I'm thinking of.

Do you know how many internships are usually available during the summer at Pratt & Miller? It seems like a pretty awesome place and I might try to get in there Summer 2009.

I already have done three co-op's at FirstEnergy (Ohio based power company) working in Hydro Plants and Coal Plants. Although this really doesn't apply to anything in the racing sense, it at least will show that I have some work experience will positive reviews from my supervisors. I also graded for Thermodynamics and Fluid Dynamics- again, not motorsport related but shows some more work that I've done. I'll also be starting undergraduate research in Materials Science this fall.

I'll keep an eye on the P&M website for any openings and apply as they become available.

I would recommend calling and emailing. Squeaky wheel gets the oil. They might want you to take some computer programming classes.

Also, I imagine the school you are thinking of is Missouri School of Science and Technology or UT Arlington. They both have wings and diffusers. Mississippi State (where I go to school) has a team. We have a PhD student who wants to put wings on the cars eventually but it is quite a task. I could give you someone to talk to if you are interested in hearing what Mississippi State has to offer.

Yea that would be good. I'm finally trying to get the ball rolling on finding out what I'm doing after graduate school so I'd like to see what is out there.

Cranfield looks like it's amazing. However it also looks like it is really expensive and not many opportunities for financial aid for students that are out of country.

University of North Carolina- Charlotte also looks kind of promising. I'm really looking for something focused kind of on racing but also on the actual academics. I'd like a special edge to be able to get into racing but not so specialized that I don't have anything to fall back on if racing doesn't pan out.

I was going to suggest MST but looks like Brian already has

http://fsae.mst.edu/

They are pretty active, a good school, and get out to St. Louis Autocross events as much as they can. They're also going to Nationals again this year AFAIK.

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I am Chris Hammond.
Going2Colorado.com

obviously unc charlotte would be the best bet on getting into the industry after grad school as they are in the motorsports mecca of the east coast. I will try and get you some info on Miss. State. I am about 90% sure you could get an assistantship like I have. That would be a small paycheck as well as having all of your school paid for. I'll pm you the email addy you should contact for info on that.

Would you recommend going there for graduate school or after graduate school?

Edit: What are some good schools in the West Coast? I know there's a bunch of racetracks out there (not only for school and work but also for myself).

oh and check this out as far as pratt and miller goes: http://fsae.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/681600868/m/33910998541

that is for full time jobs but they do hire and I know they have in the past done internships. Like I said contact them now for next summer.

Thanks to everyone for all the help. I'll definitely start contacting colleges and companies at the beginning of next week. I'm really excited that all my hard work so far might actually pay off although the really hard work is actually just beginning.

 

If you think of anything else I'll be checking this thread pretty often. I'll let you guys know what happens. 

I'm thinking about picking this up to read through so I get an idea of what engineering is involved in different systems of the car (aero, suspension, chassis, etc.). Has anyone here ever heard anything about this book?

 

http://www.amazon.com/Race-Car-Vehicle-Dynamics-R146/dp/1560915269/ref=pd_bbs_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1219284755&sr=8-2 

excellent book. it is a text book in some schools. You will learn a lot from it.

I'm also going to look into Corvid Technologies (http://www.corvidtechnologies.com/)

From their website:

Corvid Technologies draws from our lead development roles in aerodynamics for world class motorsports programs such as multiple Lemans 24 Hour winning Corvette C5R and C6R Sportscars and Championship winning NASCAR Sprint Cup teams. This coupled with our involvement in aerospace and defense programs makes Corvid Technologies a trusted resource for developing a winning solution to any complex CFD problem.

Sounds pretty good to me.

The big gray book aka Milliken is a bible of sorts for FSAE and anyone who isn't afraid of doing some math.  I haven't got all the way through the aero bits, but for FSAE, the courses are typically too tight to use aero.  Of course West this year was very open, and my team (KSU) was one of the few teams doing well in autocross w/o Aero.  Keep in mind though that typically the teams with aero have had their cars together long enough to experiment with it.

Don't get me wrong, FSAE was a blast, and being on a winning team that knows there stuff will help you in trying to get a motorsports job, fut the truth is that real racing experience is still what matters.  I've meet a few guys who were able to pull it off, but do some reading on FSAE.com and you'll see very few of these dreams come true.  There is an alumni from KSU that I know that is currently at Colorado State and is doing grad research on dampers.  FSAE helps but it will still take a LOT of persistence. 

That said I'm very happy so far in the private sector (working for Cessna Aircraft), and there is good demand for ME's so you can afford to be a little choosy in picking a job.  Also, it is harder to get a masters while working, but its MUCH cheaper to let your employer pay for it!

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#56 91 Miata STS2

I'm guessing that FSAE experience helps alot (even though like you said it's technically not "real" racing). I'd like to mess around with the aero as a sort of showcase of my abilities really.

This next question is serious (not a smartass question). If aero doesn't provide any benefit then why do some teams use it? I've seen quite a few cars with multiple spoilers/ splitters, etc.

I'm going to wait for the RCVD book (it's coming Thursday) and look through the aerodynamics section and make sure that it's something I'm capable of. I might end up finding another facet that I really like so I'm going to take a week or so and look through that. After that I'll get moving on contacting schools and companies.

 

MrDomino:

I'm guessing that FSAE experience helps alot (even though like you said it's technically not "real" racing). I'd like to mess around with the aero as a sort of showcase of my abilities really.

This next question is serious (not a smartass question). If aero doesn't provide any benefit then why do some teams use it? I've seen quite a few cars with multiple spoilers/ splitters, etc.

 UTA justifies running aero because they build their cars to autocross first and FSAE second.  I'm sure team to team the reasons change, but FSAE courses tend to be too tight to get over 50mph. There has been talk of opening up the tracks some to make aero more of an advantage though.  At FSAE west this year I was bouncing off the rev limiter hard right before some heavy breaking sections, with our gearing that comes out to 62 to 63 mph.  Had the sweepers been a little faster, the course definitely would have justified aero.

 Whether or not it is an advantage though, our team made the decision early on that getting the car done 1-2 months earlier and doing more testing would make us faster than trying to explore aero aids.

 I would interning w/ a race team as more important than FSAE, but I would still try to find a college FSAE team that would be willing to let you work on it for a masters project.

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#56 91 Miata STS2

And thus comes the hard question that no one has an answer for. How to get that initial experience that everybody wants but no one will supply.