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Last Post 27 Oct 2014 05:05 PM by  t walgamuth
New C mod in the INdy region
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t walgamuth
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14 Dec 2010 10:25 PM

    So Jimmy and I went off on Saturday morning early to go to Deleware and check out and hopefully bring back the 85 Reynard FF. Our plan was working to a T until we hit Wheeling WVA and the truck died!

    Yikes!

    So we got the truck towed to Middle Creek Towing and did some investigation and we preliminarily decided it was a bad lift pump on the big Cummnins. They then towed the beast to the Dodge dealer for verification and repair on Monday.

    On the good side, When I broke down I called my formula ford seller and he agreed to bring the race car here!

    So on Sunday about 100 we went to the local municipal park (at the suggestion of the local gendarme) and test drove the little car around a large parking lot. I managed to spin it 270 degrees on slicks in the rain and I was just trying to check all the gears. It is a tight fit but I believe I will be able to have a lot of fun with it.

    After that we went over to the towing service/auto repair/storage units/uhaul rental place that towed me in off the highway. They very generously (they are racers) allowed us to pull the race car into their garage where the seller pulled off all the body panels and explained how to fill this and adjust that for about an hour, then they allowed me to put it inside their fenced lot for security. (Thanks Doug, Gary and Gary at Middle Creek Towing!)

    So Saturday did not end so well but Sunday was a pretty grand day.

    Monday we were at the Dealer when they opened. After a few hours the diagnosis was confirmed and the parts ordered from Cleveland. They did some of the disassembly work on Monday afternoon so when the parts arrived at 8 am they were able to finish the Big Dog by 1015 am. We then picked up the FF from the impound at Middle Creek towing and headed home.

    The FF is in the garage now thawing out.

    And after Four days of forced companionship Jimmy and I are still friends and planning to co drive the Reynard next year.

    The only fly in the ointment is that while the Big Dodge was at the dealership on Sat evening and Sunday someone stole my lightweight floor jack out of the back.

    But I am still feeling pretty good about the Reynard!

    Locked
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    15 Dec 2010 09:56 AM
    Wow! What a painful trip. I'm glad you made it back with FF in tow.
    GChambers
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    15 Dec 2010 10:41 AM
    Tom, glad to see you guys finally made it back safely.

    Congrads on the car! I'm looking forward to seeing it. That makes a total of 5 CM cars in the Indy region now. Who's going to be next? :-)
    The Nebulizer
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    15 Dec 2010 11:09 AM
    GChambers wrote:
    Tom, glad to see you guys finally made it back safely.

    Congrads on the car! I'm looking forward to seeing it. That makes a total of 5 CM cars in the Indy region now. Who's going to be next? :-)


    Now all our courses are "Mod courses"... :p

    5? Did Lee get one too? I can only think of 4 - Nick, Mark, Geoff, Tom/Jimmy.

    Plus, Kevin P. got a AM (or is it BM)?
    And, Craig's FM from the end of last year.

    All these mod cars and no one is doing it right (takes a look at SportsCar calender's December picture... ) - rotary powered Sprite EM. That's how you get the best co-driver. :)
    Locked
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    15 Dec 2010 11:25 AM
    Brent Cary and Steve Gieger make #5.
    jchiu
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    15 Dec 2010 11:40 AM

    What a trip... Just to be completely clear, this is Tom's car. I can't take any credit for this car, I'm just a wheelman. ;)

    dasto
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    15 Dec 2010 12:47 PM
    Indy region CM battle is going to be fun to watch in 2011.
    t walgamuth
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    15 Dec 2010 04:20 PM
    Jimmy is a partner in spirit!
    DigDloppyFonkeyBick
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    15 Dec 2010 04:36 PM
    Crapola....

    Now I want a c-mod car.
    GChambers
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    15 Dec 2010 05:09 PM
    DigDloppyFonkeyBick wrote:
    Crapola....

    Now I want a c-mod car.

    Dooooooo IIIIIIIIIIIIT!

    Sil3nt_Ch4os
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    15 Dec 2010 06:12 PM
    The Nebulizer wrote:


    Plus, Kevin P. got a AM (or is it BM)?

    I am AM, finally took a look at the rulebook and my engine puts my out of BM. Everything else still fits restrictions for BM so I still don't think I'll be giving Clemens a challenge.


    Clemens
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    15 Dec 2010 06:24 PM

    Tom,

    Welcome to modified!

    Sorry to hear about the problems during your trip. I guess that made the new CM car a little more expensive than expected, didn't it?

    Like I told Kevin, you will remember this trip for the rest of your life. Making the first trip with a new race car on the trailer is special, even without tow car problems. I made two cross-country trips with new autocross cars, indicentally, both from Austin/TX, and both on Christmas eve/day. Those are good memories. I had my last purchase delivered. That's just not the same, although it was a lot more convenient.

    O.k., everybody, CM is full now. Everyone else needs to go to BM.... ;)

    Clemens

    Clemens
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    15 Dec 2010 06:29 PM
    Sil3nt_Ch4os wrote:

    I am AM, finally took a look at the rulebook and my engine puts my out of BM. Everything else still fits restrictions for BM so I still don't think I'll be giving Clemens a challenge.

    Kevin,

    Your engine is over 3000cc??? I didn't think so.

    From the rule book:

    ---------------------------------

    C. Sports Racers and All Open-Wheel Cars Including Formula Atlantics:

    1. May use any automotive based 2v engine up to 1300cc, any 2-stroke motor up to 900cc, any 4v or more engine up to 1005cc.

    Minimum weight with driver: 1020 lbs.

    2. May use any 2v automobile-based production engines up to 1615cc. Minimum Weight with driver: 1110 lbs.

    3. May use any 4v or more engine up to 1615cc. May use any 2-stroke up to 1300cc, Mazda 12A rotary with any porting and any

    carburetion. May use fuel injection without weight penalty as required by the GCR. Minimum weight with driver: 1180 lbs.

    4. May use any naturally-aspirated engine up to 3000cc. Minimum weight with driver: 1285 lbs.

    -----------------------------------------

    You just need to weigh 1285 lbs and meet the Formula Atlantic aero requirements. Hey, I won't tell on you if you weigh less. Welcome to BM. :)

    Clemens

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    15 Dec 2010 08:05 PM
    Clemens wrote:
    Sil3nt_Ch4os wrote:

    I am AM, finally took a look at the rulebook and my engine puts my out of BM. Everything else still fits restrictions for BM so I still don't think I'll be giving Clemens a challenge.

    Kevin,

    Your engine is over 3000cc??? I didn't think so.

    From the rule book:

    ---------------------------------

    C. Sports Racers and All Open-Wheel Cars Including Formula Atlantics:

    1. May use any automotive based 2v engine up to 1300cc, any 2-stroke motor up to 900cc, any 4v or more engine up to 1005cc.

    Minimum weight with driver: 1020 lbs.

    2. May use any 2v automobile-based production engines up to 1615cc. Minimum Weight with driver: 1110 lbs.

    3. May use any 4v or more engine up to 1615cc. May use any 2-stroke up to 1300cc, Mazda 12A rotary with any porting and any

    carburetion. May use fuel injection without weight penalty as required by the GCR. Minimum weight with driver: 1180 lbs.

    4. May use any naturally-aspirated engine up to 3000cc. Minimum weight with driver: 1285 lbs.

    -----------------------------------------

    You just need to weigh 1285 lbs and meet the Formula Atlantic aero requirements. Hey, I won't tell on you if you weigh less. Welcome to BM. :)

    Clemens



    Im 2165cc, but I don't get why I fall under the 4th category.....this was confusing me so I asked my cousin (huge beetle fan) to read them and tell me if I fit into the class, he said "No."

    My engine is a '65 VW Beetle bored out to 2165cc and mated to a VW Bus tranny.

    My gut says to go with your knowledge of the class and assume he misinterpreted something. I will be right on 1285lbs...maybe 1290.

    Locked
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    15 Dec 2010 08:29 PM
    My trip down to south florida was memorable!

    Mark and I swapped places either driving or sleeping the the back of the MDX on our 18 hour 1 way straight thru trip... We only stopped for gas and we only ate gas station food. We made good time and stuck our feet in the ocean at 5:30 a.m. in the morning. Stars filled the dark sky.

    I called the owner bright and early just before 6:00 a.m. He wasn't too pleased but agreed to letting us show up at 7:00 a.m. Driving down the 1st part of his street really had us questioning our decision to drive all that way. It was a DUMP... Eventually, it opened up to a beautiful HUGE home with a gated bricklayed drive. There were 2 Escalades, a dually, a dirt track car all sitting inside. Inside his garage sat a new C6 z06 vette, and older vette and my Formula Ford.

    The was the day after we had made the 10 hour drive home from Lincoln.

    I'd also say the trip to get Geoffs will be memorable. Finding an alternate route due to an accident on the bridge into Louisville was quite fun.
    jchiu
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    15 Dec 2010 08:31 PM
    Tom, we never figured out what the hell that 'Lilly's' place was... What a weird place.
    t walgamuth
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    15 Dec 2010 09:54 PM

    I cannot in good conscience count the truck repairs in the cost of the Reynard.

    The lift pump would have gone out someplace else if not in WVA. better to lose it with Jimmy instead of pulling my travel trailer with the Mrs and a couple of grandkids!

    I am looking forward to getting into the car!

    Eclipse2Lancer
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    16 Dec 2010 08:25 AM
    Congrats Tom.

    I didn't have to go far to get the Civic.....all the way to Brian's house in Brownsburg!
    Eclipse2Lancer
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    16 Dec 2010 08:25 AM
    stupid double post.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    16 Dec 2010 09:03 AM

    My "buy a CM" story is much less dramatic. Saw an ad in SportsCar for an 85 VD in Atlanta in summer 1991. Called a couple of Atlanta race shops for info about the car and learned that it was "good but nothing special" in regard to race ready. Called the seller and then we drove down from Raleigh to take a look and stay overnight at seller's house. We were SOLD as soon as we saw it waiting for us in the driveway! Went through all the usual "will we fit" etc. stuff and then worked out a deal. Seller delivered it to us a few days later since we did not own a trailer and he was keeping his for a Lotus 7 vintage racer. Went back to Atlanta a month or so later to pick up the custom open trailer we had made. Car received a "ground up" that winter. This winter (about 18 year later) it is receiving another "almost ground up" that isn't anywhere nearly as extensive due to the investment I made 18 years ago in AN hardware, braided hoses, etc.

    Original tow vehicle was an 88 5.0 Mustang.

    Dick

    CM 85

    85 Van Diemen

    DigDloppyFonkeyBick
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    16 Dec 2010 12:08 PM
    Okay...throw me some numbers.
    What should total investment on a CM car look like to get it ready for good solo competition?
    What do tires cost and how long do they last?

    Street tires suck. I wanna go fast again.
    Locked
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    16 Dec 2010 01:32 PM
    DigDloppyFonkeyBick wrote:
    Okay...throw me some numbers.
    What should total investment on a CM car look like to get it ready for good solo competition?
    What do tires cost and how long do they last?

    Street tires suck. I wanna go fast again.

    http://www.sccaforums.com/forums/fo...cope/posts

    Geoff, Tom and I all bought cars around $6500... Pull the fire system, add autox gears and fresh rubber. Have fun.

    nutty944
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    16 Dec 2010 06:56 PM
    Can't wait to see it in action, Tom!!!!
    t walgamuth
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    16 Dec 2010 08:13 PM
    jchiu wrote:
    Tom, we never figured out what the hell that 'Lilly's' place was... What a weird place.

    Lilly's was a place which had a small reception area with a couple of chairs and a small bar out by the front door in the strip mall. It had a long hallway and a door at the end. On the outside door was a sign that read that you had to ring a bell to get in. It looked for all the world like a house of ill repute.;)

    Is that legal in WVA?

    We were gonna ask a local about it but never got around to it.

    GChambers
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    17 Dec 2010 11:26 AM
    Locked wrote:
    DigDloppyFonkeyBick wrote:
    Okay...throw me some numbers.
    What should total investment on a CM car look like to get it ready for good solo competition?
    What do tires cost and how long do they last?

    Street tires suck. I wanna go fast again.

    http://www.sccaforums.com/forums/fo...cope/posts

    Geoff, Tom and I all bought cars around $6500... Pull the fire system, add autox gears and fresh rubber. Have fun.

    Not only that but all of the cars we bought should be Nationally competitive with just some tuning, adjustments and a new set of Hoosiers. You can't get that with any ST* cars.

    I was kinda thinking... I'm guessing most of us have a spare set of wheels for our FF cars. How would you guys feel about having a set of "local" tires for the season? We all start the season with a fresh set of tires and use them for all the local events. Might save us money and, more importantly, keep any of us from going crazy buying tires unnecessarily. I know the guys in Louisville used to do this. Just a thought...

    Locked
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    17 Dec 2010 12:37 PM
    Last year Mark and I didn't run a regional event on anything below 70+ run tires, except testing the Diemen at TH.

    We had new for blythville, wrapped them and stored those for Peru. The put 2 new on the rear after peru and swapped between those and the other "tour" tires for div events, same fronts (marks car oversteers, :smile: ). New for nationals, and used those for TH and blytheville.

    Mark pulled some rocks out of the shed for me to use as transport tires. I'm planning to use those locally until I build up some runs in a set of "tour" tires. Basically, don't fear me "out tire-ing" anyone locally.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    17 Dec 2010 12:40 PM
    GChambers wrote:

    I was kinda thinking... I'm guessing most of us have a spare set of wheels for our FF cars. How would you guys feel about having a set of "local" tires for the season? We all start the season with a fresh set of tires and use them for all the local events. Might save us money and, more importantly, keep any of us from going crazy buying tires unnecessarily. I know the guys in Louisville used to do this. Just a thought...

    I'm not in your area but I like the idea since it means single driver cars will end up with better tires to compensate for no tire warmer :-)

    Can we do something like that for Tours and Nationals? :-)

    Dick

    CM85

    85VD . . . in CM since 1992

    GChambers
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    17 Dec 2010 01:15 PM
    DigDloppyFonkeyBick wrote:
    Okay...throw me some numbers.
    What should total investment on a CM car look like to get it ready for good solo competition?
    What do tires cost and how long do they last?

    Street tires suck. I wanna go fast again.

    Check this one out....

    http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...ostcount=9

    GChambers
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    17 Dec 2010 01:18 PM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:
    GChambers wrote:

    I was kinda thinking... I'm guessing most of us have a spare set of wheels for our FF cars. How would you guys feel about having a set of "local" tires for the season? We all start the season with a fresh set of tires and use them for all the local events. Might save us money and, more importantly, keep any of us from going crazy buying tires unnecessarily. I know the guys in Louisville used to do this. Just a thought...

    I'm not in your area but I like the idea since it means single driver cars will end up with better tires to compensate for no tire warmer :-)

    Can we do something like that for Tours and Nationals? :-)

    Dick

    CM85

    85VD . . . in CM since 1992

    Dick, I thought it was the heat cycles that killed the tires, not the number of runs. With a single driver there should be roughly the same number of heat cycles as with two driver cars, correct?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    17 Dec 2010 02:37 PM
    GChambers wrote:
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:
    GChambers wrote:

    I was kinda thinking... I'm guessing most of us have a spare set of wheels for our FF cars. How would you guys feel about having a set of "local" tires for the season? We all start the season with a fresh set of tires and use them for all the local events. Might save us money and, more importantly, keep any of us from going crazy buying tires unnecessarily. I know the guys in Louisville used to do this. Just a thought...

    I'm not in your area but I like the idea since it means single driver cars will end up with better tires to compensate for no tire warmer :-)

    Can we do something like that for Tours and Nationals? :-)

    Dick

    CM85

    85VD . . . in CM since 1992

    Dick, I thought it was the heat cycles that killed the tires, not the number of runs. With a single driver there should be roughly the same number of heat cycles as with two driver cars, correct?

    Beats me. It just seemed like a "funny" thing to say. :-) For all I know "calendar time" (i.e. number of months since first run) may be just as important. Or time towing on an open trailer like I do. Or storing the car and tires in an enclosed trailer in hot weather like some guys apparently do. That said, I'm pretty sure that the more runs on a tire the more the "good stuff" tends to decrease. However, given that 2 driver cars do frequently have the "heat" advantage (unless cooling is needed) who knows?

    Also keep in mind that professional racers who change tires during a race have ZERO heat cycles (or one if they scuffed them) and they go off and not necessarily because the tires are worn out.

    However, guys with experience with the latest Hoosiers say that the tires hold up very well. I'm on my first set of those with a short season so maybe I'll be able to tell next Spring.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    18 Dec 2010 07:17 PM

    I went out today and removed a front wheel and tire. I wanted to weigh it. It weighs a few ounces less than 19#. The lug pattern and studs look substantially smaller than the miata. I had been told by the po that it was the same 4 x 100mm as the miata. I think maybe the spare steel wheels I got with it might not actually work. The lug nuts are made differently than any I have seen. They are pretty long and have a flat shoulder on them about 3/4" from the face of the hub. The disc is very small and less than 1/4" thick I would say.

    I had to admire the nice Aero shaped suspension arms.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    18 Dec 2010 10:19 PM

    Tom,

    Don't take this answer as "for sure" but I think the bolt circle is 3.75 inch if the Miata 100 mm doesn't fit. Wheel studs are likely to be 3/8" X 24. Rotor thickness front and rear for the normal LD-19 calipers is .29 inch. Dia less than 10 inches. The lug nuts are "shank" style which are used with some types of wheels. Looking at the pics you sent to me the wheels may be Revolutions or maybe Compomotives. FYI my car has centerlock wheels but the drive pins are probably on the same bolt circle. The Apex Speed guys can give you plenty of Reynard specific info. Note that at least for centerlocks the center hole in the wheel is different for Reynards than for Van Diemens and the centering ring is a matching OD.

    http://www.mcgard.com/Applications/...0ucQ%3d%3d

    Check out the rotor page of the Pegasus catalog for rotor info. FF doesn't need much brake.

    Email me if you have anything I can help with.

    Dick

    85 VD

    CM85


    t walgamuth
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    18 Dec 2010 10:58 PM
    I'm trying to figure out what gears I have now, Ron the previous owner says it will go on track 119 mph. I am wondering about the speed in first and second gear with the current gears. Thanks for the info about the wheels. For autocross is there an advantage to the center lock wheel setup? I don't see how it could be much lighter than the four lugs.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 Dec 2010 07:27 AM
    Tom,

    A couple of things:

    Lug nut torque: Lotus Europas have 3/8" lug nuts. Specified torque is 40 - 45 lb-ft which might be a good starting point until an expert tells you differently. (I have a shop manual with the Lotus torque info)

    Center lock wheel advantage: They look cool. Only one lug nut per wheel for tire changes. Don't know about weight but it would be "hub" weight rather than wheel weight I suspect. Per some old notes my front wheels/tires weigh about 18 -19 lbs and the rears are 23 - 24 lbs. In addition to the rear tires being bigger and heavier my rear wheels have significantly thicker center sections (3 piece Compomotives).

    Gearing: Assuming you don't want to just pull the gears to check yet you could simply ask the po. what ratios are in the trans and what rpm he used to determine the 119. Was 119 "redline" or just terminal velocity for that track.

    However, unless he raced on really slow tracks or with standing starts his FIRST gear is probably tall enough to be at least a 3rd gear for autox.

    Did the purchase include a collection of other gear sets?

    I don't know where you are on the transmission "learning curve" yet (it won't be hard to "climb" after you start) but please make sure you don't mix up gear sets. They come in pairs that should never be mixed up to my knowledge. The gears will be marked with both gear tooth counts such as 17:34 on one gear and 34:17 on the other (as I recall :-) )

    There is a gears for sale ad on Apex this morning. Take a look at the pics. The bottom right pic looks like a 14:36 which could be a temporary first gear or a longer term second (51 mph) assuming 9:31 r&p. If still available, the 20:30 is an 88 mph gear and the 21:30 is 90 mph and the 23:29 is about 105 mph.
    Locked
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    19 Dec 2010 11:54 AM
    Tom, send me an email and i'll get you the gear chart files. N l m y e r s at g m a i l . C o m
    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 Dec 2010 09:43 PM
    Tom,

    The 14:36 gear is no longer the one at the bottom right. Look for the set with the smallest little gear relative to the bigger gear. I think there are two pictures.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    19 Dec 2010 10:40 PM
    Actually, Nick I am pretty sure I have such a chart already in the stuff the po gave me. I don't know what is in the car though.;)
    t walgamuth
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    19 Dec 2010 10:45 PM
    I did not get any spare gears. I have asked the po what gears I have and I am not sure he knows, he just found them ok for what he was doing. He said he got the 119 mph by using a hand held GPI (is that the right term?).
    jchiu
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    19 Dec 2010 11:39 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    I did not get any spare gears. I have asked the po what gears I have and I am not sure he knows, he just found them ok for what he was doing. He said he got the 119 mph by using a hand held GPI (is that the right term?).

    GPS

    t walgamuth
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    20 Dec 2010 05:53 AM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:
    Tom,

    A couple of things:

    Lug nut torque: Lotus Europas have 3/8" lug nuts. Specified torque is 40 - 45 lb-ft which might be a good starting point until an expert tells you differently. (I have a shop manual with the Lotus torque info)

    Center lock wheel advantage: They look cool. Only one lug nut per wheel for tire changes. Don't know about weight but it would be "hub" weight rather than wheel weight I suspect. Per some old notes my front wheels/tires weigh about 18 -19 lbs and the rears are 23 - 24 lbs. In addition to the rear tires being bigger and heavier my rear wheels have significantly thicker center sections (3 piece Compomotives).

    Gearing: Assuming you don't want to just pull the gears to check yet you could simply ask the po. what ratios are in the trans and what rpm he used to determine the 119. Was 119 "redline" or just terminal velocity for that track.

    However, unless he raced on really slow tracks or with standing starts his FIRST gear is probably tall enough to be at least a 3rd gear for autox.

    Did the purchase include a collection of other gear sets?

    I don't know where you are on the transmission "learning curve" yet (it won't be hard to "climb" after you start) but please make sure you don't mix up gear sets. They come in pairs that should never be mixed up to my knowledge. The gears will be marked with both gear tooth counts such as 17:34 on one gear and 34:17 on the other (as I recall :-) )

    There is a gears for sale ad on Apex this morning. Take a look at the pics. The bottom right pic looks like a 14:36 which could be a temporary first gear or a longer term second (51 mph) assuming 9:31 r&p. If still available, the 20:30 is an 88 mph gear and the 21:30 is 90 mph and the 23:29 is about 105 mph.

    The PO says it is one of the following:

    9:31 R/P RATIO

    a) 1ST GEAR - 19/32

    b) 2ND GEAR - 22/30

    c) 3RD GEAR - 24/28

    d) 4TH GEAR - 25/25 or 26/26 (no mixing)

    4TH GEAR - 25/25 or 26/26 (no mixing)

    2) 10:31 R/P RATIO

    e) 1ST GEAR - 18/34

    f) 2ND GEAR - 20/30

    g) 3RD GEAR - 22/29

    h) 4TH GEAR - 24/27

    He is trying to figure out which it is. I suppose if he cannot I may have to pull it all apart myself and see. Or I can perhaps rotate the wheels and see what it does....hmmm, on an old fashoned car I can rotate the wheel and count ds rotations but since there is no ds it would be rotating the clutch pp I guess. is there a window to look at the pp from outside?
    Dick Rasmussen
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    20 Dec 2010 07:24 AM

    Tom,

    Edit to add: I don't have a gear chart handy but none of the po's first gear guesses are lower than maybe an autox 3rd if you use my "tall" second approach. For the much more normal approach they might be 4th's. All the others are either sell or long term storage . . . which is the norm for gears from a road racer. I still have a bunch that came with my car in 1991.

    At this point you probably should open up the Trans and see what you have. Too many unknowns due to the R&P not known or the gears. Time for a look see. Just give yourself plenty of time so you don't feel rushed. Sounds like a nice holiday project. :-)

    My guess is that one or both of the dog rings will need replacement also. Taylor and others frequently have good used dogs and gears. That is a good way to get your initial "best guesses" for what gears you will want. I may still be using some I bought that way.

    I think I read in one of the CM Quarterly's that the R&P ratio is scribed on the end of the pinion shaft but you need to pull the rear cover to see it.

    FYI this is an old fashioned car. 60's engine and even earlier transmission case . . . (air cooled VW case) :-)

    There must be a window to see the timing mark somewhere (location varies with car).

    Dick

    PCalhoun
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    20 Dec 2010 10:42 AM

    If the PO was running w/ FRCCA on the East Coast they run sealed gearboxes w/ fixed ratios based on the R&P. The list of ratios in the post above is straight out of their rulebook and my guess would be that an 85 is a 9:31 car.

    Either way you are going to want to pull the bearing carrier to change the fluid and inspect the gears and dogs. Which you would have to-do anyway to install an auto-x integral 1st gear.

    Recommend you download the PDF of the Hewland Mk 9 Service Manual off the Hewland UK website.

    pru
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    20 Dec 2010 11:20 AM

    As a follow up to Pete's post: Hewland Engineering Ltd MK9 Manual Download

    Specifically, page 11 "GEARBOX DISASSEMBLY" and page 16 "ILLUSTRATED PARTS LIST"

    Dick Rasmussen
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    20 Dec 2010 01:15 PM
    Have any of the longer term CM guys used a 14:36 slide on for first gear (51 mph with 9:31 r&p) for sites with few "high grip" starts? I know lots of guys either did or do use one for second.

    If this gear can handle relatively easy starts and "initial funds" for buying an integral first gear are limited for any of the new guys in the class one came up for sale on Apex Speed over the weekend. See the link I posted above.

    I suspect most of us are running a mid 40's integral first so 51 won't be too bad if the sites are not too grippy and/or the tires aren't "fresh". I.e. you will probably be wheelspin limited anyway, especially when the weather is cool/cold.

    Dick
    Jim G
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    20 Dec 2010 08:35 PM
    An integral first gear is really pricey but it's the one big expenditure that is recommended. Going with a slide on might work if the driver was always careful with starts. Might have to do a lot of clutch slipping, so that's a cost (in time as well as money) that you can use to rationalize the expenditure.
    t walgamuth
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    20 Dec 2010 10:56 PM

    Now I believe I understand what an integral first gear means. It is a gear fused to the shaft for more strength, right? So I might pull the gearbox apart soon to see exactly what I have.

    My old Ferrari 250 had the timing marks on the edge of the flywheel, visible from straight above right back by the firewall. I can imagine one somewhere similar on this old Kent motor.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    21 Dec 2010 07:35 AM
    Tom,

    An integral first gear actually is machined as part of the shaft. Even better than "fused".

    There should be either an inspection hole in the bellhousing or in my car, the bellhousing is open on the right side so that I can see the flywheel. In my case the "reference pointer" for timing is the bottom corner of the block surface where the oil pan attaches. If you are lucky there will be color coding to identify TDC and 38 BTDC. However, you may find more than one set of marks since engine builders have to accommodate numerous cars.

    Dick
    Locked
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    21 Dec 2010 10:17 AM
    Tom, my gearbox is apart right now. If you want to see it in pieces before taking yours apart your welcome to come by.
    t walgamuth
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    21 Dec 2010 11:52 AM
    I would like that very much! Would an evening this week work (not Friday).?
    t walgamuth
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    21 Dec 2010 11:54 AM
    I can't seem to pm you. twalgamuth@comcast.net
    Jim G
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    21 Dec 2010 12:19 PM

    Here are some photos I took last winter:

    Dick Rasmussen
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    21 Dec 2010 01:15 PM
    Yuck :-) I assume the "green slime" is Redline Shockproof gear oil. (I'm going to use it for the first time this winter)

    Dick
    Mechie3
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    21 Dec 2010 02:32 PM
    Whoa....how did I miss this thread? Cool to see more mod cars in the region in the coming year!
    Jim G
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    21 Dec 2010 03:11 PM
    My wife won't let me back in the house after playing with gears because of the smell. She makes me run my hands through something that smells better first, like rabbit poop.
    t walgamuth
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    21 Dec 2010 09:49 PM

    Whooooaaaaahhhhh!

    Lucky for me I have two rabbits!;)

    PCalhoun
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    21 Dec 2010 10:22 PM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:
    Yuck :-) I assume the "green slime" is Redline Shockproof gear oil. (I'm going to use it for the first time this winter)

    Dick

    Yes, the aqua color is that of Red Line Shockproof Lite. It works as advertised in softening the blows of metal-to-metal contact between the gear clusters.

    For the new guys out there you will need one quart for a gear change and it is always a good idea to keep a spare quart around for if your box drips at all. Also, keep a tube of Hylomar handy for reassemby of the bearing carrier and rear cover; it is much nicer to work w/ than RTV.

    Jim G
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    21 Dec 2010 10:33 PM
    PCalhoun wrote: Also, keep a tube of Hylomar handy for reassemby of the bearing carrier and rear cover; it is much nicer to work w/ than RTV.

    +1 !!!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    22 Dec 2010 07:40 AM
    For you new guys don't be "put off" by some of the "stuff" we suggest you buy or learn at the beginning of your real race car experience. Except for obvious consumables like gear oil and to some degree sealants like Hylomar much of what you buy or learn now will serve you well for years to come if you stay in CM. I may be an extreme example but I still have and use stuff I bought for this car in 1991 - 1993.

    Another thing to do as you take stuff apart is to read up on how to select AN hardware (bolts, nuts, washers) in Smith's books and then buy what you need and some extras of each size. Especially any small stuff like 10-32's since they are cheap and more likely to actually need replacement. Pegasus's catalog is a GREAT reference source for the hardware with dimensions, etc. They are also a VERY convenient source for buying the stuff even though others MAY have better prices.

    FYI my "inventory" of various hardware items is stored in several Sto and Go Rack organizers from Planomolding:

    http://www.planomolding.com/toolbox...roducts-2/

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    25 Dec 2010 06:29 PM

    I'm now calculating and scheming about what gears to buy for autocrossing my Reynard. Also trying to identify ways to reduce weight.

    I went down thursday and looked a Nick's car. I had a wonderful edifying time with him and Mark. Thanks guys!

    t walgamuth
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    31 Dec 2010 08:19 AM

    I found a chassis sheet among the things the PO gave me. In it I find that the car is already pretty light. He weighs 185 and it was about 1120 with him in it as it sits now.

    I also have dyno sheets from when he had it rebuilt about a year and a half ago and it looks pretty strong. The head must flow pretty well.

    I also have his race records for two and a half years and running in the club he was in he placed first more than anything else, second most of the other times and only one sixth place and a dnf.

    So I am pretty pumped.

    With the above freezing weather I will be pulling the car out of the garage and washing it and the trailer off. Then I plan to put it on the new yellow steel sawhorses I got for my birthday.

    In my examination of the car I found a slightly bent push rod and am pondering if I should try to do something about that.

    I have also found there are a lot of body panels missing.....lower rear panel (removed for cooling apparently) and some shrouds leading from the large naca duct on the side to the rads.

    t walgamuth
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    01 Jan 2011 03:34 PM

    Two questions:

    1. where do you recommend getting an integral first gear?

    2. Where to get a lug nut that is just made for simple steel wheels with the small threads that my four lug wheel set up has?

    Clemens
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    01 Jan 2011 07:07 PM

    Tom,

    I'd try ApexSpeed for a used one, if you want to save money. Here is one that may still be available:

    http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...egral+gear

    If it is not the right ratio or if it is sold, post a want ad. Somebody may have one sitting at home. Beats paying for a new one.

    What's special about your lug nuts? You can't get them at an auto parts store like AutoZone?

    Clemens

    Dick Rasmussen
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    01 Jan 2011 08:02 PM

    Tom,

    Have you confirmed that the studs are 3/8 -24? If so and you cannot find "auto parts store" versions, Pegasus p/n 3548-008 at $2.99 each is a high price alternative. These are generally described as Triumph Spitfire size. Also this may be an ATV size. I have not confirmed this but I think you need a 60 degree taper which appears to be common.


    t walgamuth
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    02 Jan 2011 08:18 AM

    Thanks Dick and Clemens!

    I'm gonna look at the gear now!

    t walgamuth
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    02 Jan 2011 08:57 AM
    Clemens wrote:

    Tom,

    I'd try ApexSpeed for a used one, if you want to save money. Here is one that may still be available:

    http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...egral+gear

    If it is not the right ratio or if it is sold, post a want ad. Somebody may have one sitting at home. Beats paying for a new one.

    What's special about your lug nuts? You can't get them at an auto parts store like AutoZone?

    Clemens

    Clemens, I could not get that link to work. Can you tell me which section of the site to look in, please?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    02 Jan 2011 09:20 AM
    Tom,

    Were you logged in to Apex? The link worked for me but it is a "search link". I found the direct link and posted it below.


    Seller's name is Brian Graham in Ontario, Canada.

    http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...hp?t=39319

    Have layshaft with integral gear 13 37, used. Also have two new gears, 16 36, and 15 37. Maybe of interest to someone, all 3 pieces for $250. brian.bgr@xplornet.com
    t walgamuth
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    02 Jan 2011 06:32 PM
    OK, I did see that but it did not seem to be the result of the link. I think the integral gear is one I can use, the other two I am not sure about yet. Is the 250 a good price for a good used integral first gear?
    Jim G
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    02 Jan 2011 08:50 PM
    Brand new they are over $450.

    Plus, those other two gears are autocross second gears. Some people run higher seconds but for the cost, those would be good to add to an autocross collection.
    t walgamuth
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    02 Jan 2011 08:55 PM

    Great! I just found the ad again and sent him a pm of interest.

    Thanks for the kind assistance!

    Tom

    GChambers
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    t walgamuth
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    06 Jan 2011 09:40 PM
    That looks very cool G! Too bad it is in new Jersey and pickup only. If it were closer I would spring for the parts just to have some options. The shape of the cowl looks interesting.
    t walgamuth
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    08 Jan 2011 11:05 AM

    I am thinking of ways to solve my fitment problem. I can get in and out satisfactorily now but once in the frame is so tight against my shoulders and upper arms I cannot turn the wheel more than 1/8 turn left or right. It looks like if I can get the steering wheel a little further away I could get a little more movement. Is there a kit available which would allow me to slide the wheel in or out? Nick has suggested removing the present seat and experimenting with that. My favorite machinist suggested pushing the frame tubs out with a hydraulic frame pusher. I looked and it looks like I could push them out 1/4 to 3/8" each side without running into problems getting the side panels on.

    Comments and suggestions?

    t walgamuth
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    08 Jan 2011 11:07 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    That looks very cool G! Too bad it is in new Jersey and pickup only. If it were closer I would spring for the parts just to have some options. The shape of the cowl looks interesting.

    I sent that seller a pm asking if he would consider putting it all on a pallet and shipping it to me.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    08 Jan 2011 12:00 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I am thinking of ways to solve my fitment problem. I can get in and out satisfactorily now but once in the frame is so tight against my shoulders and upper arms I cannot turn the wheel more than 1/8 turn left or right. It looks like if I can get the steering wheel a little further away I could get a little more movement. Is there a kit available which would allow me to slide the wheel in or out? Nick has suggested removing the present seat and experimenting with that. My favorite machinist suggested pushing the frame tubs out with a hydraulic frame pusher. I looked and it looks like I could push them out 1/4 to 3/8" each side without running into problems getting the side panels on.

    Comments and suggestions?

    Tom,

    My steering shaft telescopes. That is it has two tubes with one being smaller diameter. There is a clamp on the end of the larger tube and an additional bolt through both tubes. Don't get the wheel too close to the dash or you won't have finger room. Looking at the pics you posted that I downloaded the big red knob on the right may need to be relocated. It looks like your shaft is long enough to modify. I'll email some pics.

    Even at 5'7" in my car it is critical to get my shoulders below the diagonal braces. From the one good seat pic of your car the seat certainly looks like it is holding you way above the floor. Great if you are road racing and have a real bead seat material to absorb impact but not needed for autocrossing. My seat is about 1/8 inch thick fiberglass directly on the floor pan. The seat is supplemented with a 1/2 thick or so insert behind my butt and back to push me forward a little which also lowers my shoulder.

    Dick



    t walgamuth
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    08 Jan 2011 04:29 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    That looks very cool G! Too bad it is in new Jersey and pickup only. If it were closer I would spring for the parts just to have some options. The shape of the cowl looks interesting.

    I sent the seller a question to see if he would ship to me.

    t walgamuth
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    08 Jan 2011 04:33 PM

    I'll take a closer look at the steering column. I removed the diagonal shoulder braces which go from mid way on the side to the roll bar. I am going to pull the seat out today and see what happens.

    Thanks Dick!

    PCalhoun
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    08 Jan 2011 04:46 PM

    As Dick mentions your steering column should tele-scope within a limited range of travel. If not look into having a machinist build you a spacer for your steering wheel or build a new column, which does tele-scope, including new Apex joints. Your shoulders need to fit under the hoizontal and/or diagonal side bars. In a formula car fit your shoulders first, then the steering column and pedals to get comfortable. If you need a machinst Chicago Region member Kevin Taylor's shop KevTec is up in Highland off Rt 41.

    It would be rare if you were able to fit into the car comfrortably w/ the POs seat unless you were very similair in size. Just plan on buying a two-part foam kit, some heavy-duty plastic bags, and pouring your own to fit your requirements. Clean it-up after it sets w/ sa Sureform file and sandpaper, plus a quick trip to Hobby Lobby for some spray adhesive and inexpensive thin fabric and in a few hours you'll fit in the car much better.

    As to your previous inquiry about gears. I mentioned this in my CM intro post back around Thanksgiving, but Taylor Race Engineering (TRE) is about the only Hewland dealer stocking the integral first gear and is generally recognized as the gearbox experts. There are others out there such as Williams, J&J, & Averill plus many more doing rebuilds, but no one stocks more parts than TRE in TX.

    t walgamuth
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    08 Jan 2011 06:44 PM

    Ok, it was very similar to yours, Dick. I moved the column forward to the next hole which was maybe 1.5" or so. Now I can get 1/4 turn off center each way! My elbows are hitting my ribcage. So tomorrow I will pull out the seat and see if I can get my butt down a bit more and the ribcage lower in relationship to the elbows.

    My car shows signs of having been converted from the older style suspension to the push rod suspension it has now.

    t walgamuth
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    08 Jan 2011 06:48 PM

    Oh, thanks Mr. Calhoun.

    I have to pull my back cover at least and verify that I have the 10/31 diff.

    My side tubes appear to be bent in about 1/2 to 3/8" on the sides for some reason. The tube comes straight along the footwell then bends in at the passenger compartment. There is a weld on the rs of the car so maybe it got wrecked on that side and they bent in the left to match it!?!

    Thanks for the kind assistance!

    barryott
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    08 Jan 2011 08:00 PM

    ....and just to jump on the band wagon. Tom, you gotta make your own seat, it is one of the neatest things about owning a formula car :-) Take out the one that came with the car and start from there. It's so cool to "wear' a car, you feel *everything* the car is doing. The seat in my Reynard fit me so well that it was a little hard to breathe if I wore a sweatshirt :-) I used the two part foam method (from Pegasus) in the Reynard but the VD has enough room that I'm going to do a Bead Seat this time. There's a good, current thread on ApexSpeed if you go the Bead Seat route.

    Is this fun or what!!!!

    Barry

    Dick Rasmussen
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    08 Jan 2011 08:42 PM
    Locked
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    08 Jan 2011 11:24 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Ok, it was very similar to yours, Dick.  I moved the column forward to the next hole which was maybe 1.5" or so.  Now I can get 1/4 turn off center each way!  My elbows are hitting my ribcage.  So tomorrow I will pull out the seat and see if I can get my butt down a bit more and the ribcage lower in relationship to the elbows.

    My car shows signs of having been converted from the older style suspension to the push rod suspension it has now.

     

     



    Tom, can we find a time for me to see you in your car? Email me.

    You need to get the current seat out of the car.. I have a spacer that potentially could be used if you want to extend the steering wheel more...
    PCalhoun
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    09 Jan 2011 09:54 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    My car shows signs of having been converted from the older style suspension to the push rod suspension it has now.

    85F Reynards were all push-rod cars front & rear from the factory, some were later backdated to the 84 style rocker arm suspension in the rear. The pictures in the original ad do not have a good shot of the rear of the car, but being that this car was owned/driven by Jeremy Treadway at some point in its life, it is a possibility that it was backdated on the rear.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    09 Jan 2011 10:09 AM
    PCalhoun wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:

    My car shows signs of having been converted from the older style suspension to the push rod suspension it has now.

    85F Reynards were all push-rod cars front & rear from the factory, some were later backdated to the 84 style rocker arm suspension in the rear. The pictures in the original ad do not have a good shot of the rear of the car, but being that this car was owned/driven by Jeremy Treadway at some point in its life, it is a possibility that it was backdated on the rear.

    Peter,

    According to pics Tom sent previously the car is pushrod front and rear as he said. :-)

    t walgamuth
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    09 Jan 2011 11:48 AM
    It is push rod front and rear. I am pretty sure I know the difference between this and the rocker style which NIck's VD is. I found a picture of the car with different bodywork on the back. In fact a lower style rear is included which I trial fitted to the car last night and it will not clear the bump where the spring shock force is converted to the push rod. So perhaps it was originally an 84. I did get the wonderful factory binder with the car though which depicts everything as it is now in the car. If it was converted perhaps it was done at the factory. Today I plan to remove the seat and look at the dash to see if I can raise the steering wheel a bit.
    PCalhoun
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    09 Jan 2011 03:30 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    It is push rod front and rear. I am pretty sure I know the difference between this and the rocker style which NIck's VD is. I found a picture of the car with different bodywork on the back. In fact a lower style rear is included which I trial fitted to the car last night and it will not clear the bump where the spring shock force is converted to the push rod. So perhaps it was originally an 84. I did get the wonderful factory binder with the car though which depicts everything as it is now in the car. If it was converted perhaps it was done at the factory. Today I plan to remove the seat and look at the dash to see if I can raise the steering wheel a bit.

    If it has push-rods on all four corners, it is orignal in layout, except for any modifications done over the years by POs. None of the 85 cars which were backdated to rockers in the rear were done at the factory, they were all done by private owners w/ parts from Prince or other fabrication specialists. The 85 is a completely unique design, which was Reynards attempt to copy the success of the Swift DB1 in the States and the VD 85 in the UK. Nothing is interchangeable to the Reynard 83/4 generation rocker arm cars (like Elzinga's or Bullis'), except the rear suspension w/ a fair amount of work & investment. 85s were also used by the Bridgestone Racing School up in Canada in 2.0L form up until 2 years ago.

    t walgamuth
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    13 Jan 2011 06:34 AM
    Hey you Indy region Cmod guys....gonna go to the awards banquet? Wanna have a cmod table?
    Locked
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    14 Jan 2011 12:10 PM
    I have a conflict.
    t walgamuth
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    16 Jan 2011 11:01 PM
    I have it up on the sawhorses now. I have figured out a bunch of things I can remove from the car to reduce weight. Next thing is to remove the gearbox cover to see what gears I have. With the seat out there is a lot more room to work with. I may try to reposition it before jumping to the bag seat idea.
    Jim G
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    19 Jan 2011 06:43 PM
    A 17:34 could make a good second or third gear (depending on your strategy). For sale now for $80! http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...hp?t=43578
    t walgamuth
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    20 Jan 2011 06:10 AM
    Thanks Jim! I still need to pull my cover and see what my final drive ratio is before buying any gears!
    t walgamuth
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    18 Feb 2011 09:36 PM

    Jimmy and I determined last night that it has the 10/31 diff. We discussed gearing strategy. Our experience is with Miatas both of us so we are not really sure what speed range we need to accomodate for autocross with a FF. Any suggestions?

    Since it is the taller diff I suppose we need a good low first gear to launch.

    jchiu
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    18 Feb 2011 10:09 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Jimmy and I determined last night that it has the 10/31 diff. We discussed gearing strategy. Our experience is with Miatas both of us so we are not really sure what speed range we need to accomodate for autocross with a FF. Any suggestions?

    Since it is the taller diff I suppose we need a good low first gear to launch.

    I guess to clarify a bit on what Tom is asking, we are trying to see if anyone could chime in on what speeds you'd say the FF operates at (beyond the launch) for a regular autocross course. Is 40mph-75mph a reasonable range or am I being a bit optimistic on the low end?

    PCalhoun
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    18 Feb 2011 11:40 PM

    1st 12:38 or 13:37

    2nd 15:36

    3rd 17:34

    4th 19:31

    Are good starting points for a 10:31. Recommend Taylor Race Engineering (TRE) for gear purchases and use of Red Line Shockproof in the 'box. Definitely get a hold of a Hewland gear chart and plot your gears for speed and RPM drop; the chart is available on-line at hewland.com. If you get me your e-mail address I can send you one in Excel next week that is very handy to use; can't figure out how to post an attachment here.

    t walgamuth
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    19 Feb 2011 06:29 AM
    Thanks Pat! I have a gear chart. We had roughed out some gear selections. I'll go look and see what they are compared to your suggestion.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 Feb 2011 08:03 AM

    Regarding first gear: From my Pro Solo, etc. experience with grippy pavement and warm/hot tires an approximately 45/46 mph at 6800 rpm first gear was the tallest that I think will work without having to slip the clutch a lot versus mild tire spin IF you have straight line starts on clean pavement. If I did the math right that means for your 10:31 r&p you would need the 12:38 first gear. However, if you are likely to have a tight turn near the start line then the taller first that you can use after the turn might be a better choice since you won't be doing "drag race" starts anyway. Always trade offs.

    Peter's recommended second would be good for about 60 mph and the third for 72/73 mph.


    Hey Peter, should we expect a new brand of FF tires given your upcoming new adventure?
    t walgamuth
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    19 Feb 2011 01:51 PM

    Thanks guys!

    I'll go ponder my ratios!;)

    t walgamuth
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    20 Feb 2011 09:46 AM

    A couple of things:

    1. What is the desired top speed we will need in a C mod?

    2. My engine is set up to a Virginia FF club spec's which specify fairly weak valve springs which will allow float at 6500 RPM, so I am planning to use slightly taller gears to work with the rpm range which is possible. Of course I could install stronger valve springs too as far as that goes, but I don't know much about all the other variables that might be taylored to the rpm range it works at.

    Thanks very much!

    t walgamuth
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    20 Feb 2011 10:28 AM
    I know someone already sent me a pdf or a link to the manual for the gearbox but I cannot find it to save myself. Could someone provide that again, please?
    Jim G
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    20 Feb 2011 03:43 PM

    Manual is here: www.hewland.com

    The fastest I've ever gone in a "real" autocross is in the low 70s. But I've been at PCA and BMW events where top speed can sometimes get into the low 80s.

    Jim

    Dick Rasmussen
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    20 Feb 2011 06:16 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    A couple of things:

    1. What is the desired top speed we will need in a C mod?

    2. My engine is set up to a Virginia FF club spec's which specify fairly weak valve springs which will allow float at 6500 RPM, so I am planning to use slightly taller gears to work with the rpm range which is possible. Of course I could install stronger valve springs too as far as that goes, but I don't know much about all the other variables that might be taylored to the rpm range it works at.

    Thanks very much!

    Tom,

    Do you have a rev limiter?

    You might check with a FF engine builder whether or not using valve float as an autox rev limiter is safe for the engine. In fact, maybe contact the pro builder who did your engine. For me at least, keeping the revs below redline (whatever the rpm) is pretty difficult in an autox.

    However, I understand some (if not all) of the fastest CM guys do so it appears I may need to work on "plan B".

    Jim's top speed info is consistent with my experience. I did have a local event many years ago that had me on the 6800 rev limit in a 78 mph 4th NUMEROUS times per run.



    Jim G
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    20 Feb 2011 08:09 PM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:

    Do you have a rev limiter?

    You might check with a FF engine builder whether or not using valve float as an autox rev limiter is safe for the engine.

    However, I understand some (if not all) of the fastest CM guys do so it appears I may need to work on "plan B".




    I use a rev limiter and would not ever think of using valve float as a "limiter". And I think the majority of C Mod guys use a rev limiter too. It's one thing to use valve float when you're at 110 mph with a 23/29 gear and the engine acceleration is, well ... "acceleration" isn't really a descriptive term in this situation. But it's completely different when you're using a 13/38 gear or even an 18/xx gear. Protect your investment. It's not expensive.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    20 Feb 2011 10:07 PM

    If you do get a rev limiter there are several choices as discussed in this thread or elsewhere. The Pegasus catalog shows several brands that include "soft touch" electronic limiting. I used a now obsolete Microdynamics at first but since that one was not user adjustable switched to the MSD with the selector switch accessory that covered the target rev range. Summit sold it for less than Pegasus but they don't seem to carry "our rev" range selector switch. Since the MSD is very bulky/large I just bought the current Microdynamics unit which is small and frees up space for a data acquisition box when I get one.

    I did try a rev limiting rotor from Ivey last summer but decided that I wanted the electronic "smooth cut" instead.

    As usual, lots of choices.

    t walgamuth
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    20 Feb 2011 10:35 PM

    The rev limiting rotor sounds like a good first choice for me. I can see that with our engine rpm range in autross it will be possible to hit the top rpm pretty hard so floating the valves might just float them into the pistons.

    Thanks for the thoughts guys!

    t walgamuth
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    01 Mar 2011 04:19 PM

    OK, i think i have figured out what gears I want to buy. I have a 19/32 which I'll use as fourth for now. I won't expect to use it much on course. I am looking for 14/36, 16/34 and 18/33 to buy second hand if possible.

    Anybody have some of these to sell?

    t walgamuth
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    04 Mar 2011 07:37 PM
    I looked in the Pegasus catalogue and don't seem to find any autocross gears available. Can someone direct me to a source for the correct gears please?
    pru
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    04 Mar 2011 08:15 PM
    Taylor Race Engineering : Product Categories : Transmissions : MK Series : Gearsets MK
    PCalhoun
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    04 Mar 2011 10:23 PM

    14:36 is too high for first...not matter if you have a 9:31 or 10:31 R&P. As mentioned TRE is the place to buy gears; Pegasus only has a limited selection, -Pru- has the link above to the appropriate TRE catalog section. Optional REM coating also helps w/ gear life if you order from TRE..

    Before ordering the ratios you have listed take a serious look at your proposed gears vs those I recommended in an earlier post. I can e-mail you an electronic Excel formatted gear chart to plot them if you supply your e-mail address.

    jchiu
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    04 Mar 2011 10:32 PM
    PCalhoun wrote:

    14:36 is too high for first...not matter if you have a 9:31 or 10:31 R&P. As mentioned TRE is the place to buy gears; Pegasus only has a limited selection, -Pru- has the link above to the appropriate TRE catalog section. Optional REM coating also helps w/ gear life if you order from TRE..

    Before ordering the ratios you have listed take a serious look at your proposed gears vs those I recommended in an earlier post. I can e-mail you an electronic Excel formatted gear chart to plot them if you supply your e-mail address.

    I'm interested in this excel file too please. jimmychiu at comcast dot net

    Dick Rasmussen
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    05 Mar 2011 07:26 AM

    Peter: I would like the gear spreadsheet also.

    Tom: For what its worth - That 14:36 with a 10:31 r&p is a 55 mph plus (at 6.8K) gear.

    Been there, done that. It can "work" as an interim (budget realities) solution if you have a stock clutch due to the clutch slip needed to launch even on relatively low grip surfaces. Your engine/carb must work well at low revs also with the progressive secondary still functional (no "synchronizing linkage" on the carb). You won't like it since it will be like launching a street car in second gear. After my first Pro Solo which was on high grip concrete I changed to a 41 mph first. It turned out to be a little too short for my taste so I changed to my current 45 mph first.

    Of course, my first drives with my car were at a road racing drivers school and subsequent races. First gear was at least a 78 mph gear but we did not do standing starts.

    Dick


    t walgamuth
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    05 Mar 2011 03:23 PM

    twalgamuth@comcast.net

    In watching Mark launch last year my memory is that he had a lot of wheelspin in first and shifted to second right away and not long after that went to third. A little taller first seems like it might be useful. OTOH I don't know what gears he is running nor what diff.

    Jimmy and I were thinking to try to set up the gears so we would not need to shift any more than needed. Fourth would be seldom used but second and third would be the ones to use on course.

    Thnaks for the fast feedback guys!

    t walgamuth
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    05 Mar 2011 03:27 PM


    Also we are planning to set up the gears to use the power generated by my engine based on the torque and horspower curves shown by the rebuilder. The engine is set up to have a max rpm of 6500 due to the virginia rules the PO ran under.

    I am used to slipping the clutch a bit on takeoff. I suppose changing a clutch might be actually tougher on a FF than a Miata though.;)

    Tom

    Dick Rasmussen
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    05 Mar 2011 07:11 PM

    Tom,

    Very understandable logic. Lots of tradeoffs and options based on the courses you usually run and personal preference. I did find that with fresh 25B's on a warm day on good asphalt that even my 45 mph 1st needed a lot of revs to gently spin the tires with a racing clutch. This year I will have a lightened flywheel also so it may be harder to launch.

    How hard a clutch change is really depends on your car. However if you have a healthy stock clutch it will probably outlast the engine unless you literally "smoke it". My car is "relatively" easy to split for a clutch inspection/change or replacing the clutch slave cylinder seals. I literally support the rear module on a dolly and "roll" it back from the engine.

    Dick

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    05 Mar 2011 07:21 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    twalgamuth@comcast.net

    In watching Mark launch last year my memory is that he had a lot of wheelspin in first and shifted to second right away and not long after that went to third.  A little taller first seems like it might be useful.  OTOH I don't know what gears he is running nor what diff.

    Jimmy and I were thinking to try to set up the gears so we would not need to shift any more than needed.  Fourth would be seldom used but second and third would be the ones to use on course.

    Thnaks for the fast feedback guys!

     



    The part you are missing with the "extra" shift(s) of Marks car compared to a street car is just how much faster a shift can be made. Don't be afraid to shift these cars. Embrace it, it's just another part of making the experience that much better over a street car.

    Even with Marks integral 1st gear without the wheelspin off the line the rpms will fall below the powerband and the motor will bog. There were events when I was struggling hitting the 1-2 shift I would come off the line in 2nd. In comparing to Mark using the maxQ he would beat me 3 tenths to sometime 1/2 a second.. That's a ton of time to be behind just coming off the line.
    jchiu
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    05 Mar 2011 10:48 PM
    For those that are still looking for the excel file to calculate the speeds, I made a file. You can get it here:

    http://web.ics.purdue.edu/~chiu2/RF...ratios.xls

    For reference I have listed ALL of the integral first gear ratios available on TRE.
    Edit the RED boxes to change final drive ratio, gear ratios, tire diameter as you want to play around with it.
    t walgamuth
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    06 Mar 2011 06:55 AM

    Thanks all for the great advice!

    Jimmy and I will probably get together later today and hash out what to buy.

    Tom

    PCalhoun
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    06 Mar 2011 04:09 PM

    For those that requested a copy of the Excel gear chart, which will show the speeds at a given rpm plus plot them on a graph be patient. The chart allows you to change gears, R&P, max RPM, plus tire diameter to compare two different sets of gears. I am in the process of moving this week and they are on my computer which is currently down. I may have another copy here on a memory stick I will check. Nick you have the copy I gave you to share?

    As to first gear selection and launch, first you need an integral first no matter the ratio. I you go w/ said 14:36 I guestimate you will lose .3-.5 seconds right off the launch while accelerating.to a shorter geared car. Second a slide-on 1st will not live more than a few events if you launch w/ any sort of authority. On launch you can slip one of two things to save your driveline; clutch or tires. With a race clutch installed tires will generally break loose first to 'cushion' the launch.on gears, CV's, drive & stub axles, not the mention the R&P. Just another reason to use Red Line Shockproof in the 'box too. If you saw Mark spinning the wheels in 2nd it was on asphalt not concrete; at Peru for example the launch RPM can be quite high to get R25s to spin and not bog.

    How was the 6500 redline achieved for FRCCA; rpm limiter, rotor, or softer than stock valve springs? With stock valve springs it is not uncommon to go 6800 w/ spikes to 7000 while holding a gear to eliminate a shift. If nothing else you should be adjusting the valves as part of pre-season prep and checking the ignition components anyway. I wouldn't let 6500 stick in your head when choosing gears, use the std 6800, but if you have dyno sheets for the motor that is an important data point too.

    PCalhoun
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    06 Mar 2011 04:17 PM
    Jimmy- Your chart is off as the rear tire diameter is incorrect; use 22.5" as the diameter when computing for a FF1600.
    jchiu
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    06 Mar 2011 06:20 PM
    PCalhoun wrote:
    Jimmy- Your chart is off as the rear tire diameter is incorrect; use 22.5" as the diameter when computing for a FF1600.

    Yeah I noticed that when Tom and I were going over the ratios today. The 21" is the front tire diameter, 22.6" for the rear, though I guess 22.0" is probably close once you factor in the dynamic rolling radius. The file has been updated to account for the rear tire diameter.

    Locked
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    06 Mar 2011 07:21 PM
    PCalhoun wrote:

    For those that requested a copy of the Excel gear chart, which will show the speeds at a given rpm plus plot them on a graph be patient. The chart allows you to change gears, R&P, max RPM, plus tire diameter to compare two different sets of gears.   I am in the process of moving this week and they are on my computer which is currently down.  I may have another copy here on a memory stick I will check.  Nick you have the copy I gave you to share?

    As to first gear selection and launch, first you need an integral first no matter the ratio.  I you go w/ said 14:36 I guestimate you will lose .3-.5 seconds right off the launch while accelerating.to a shorter geared car.  Second a slide-on 1st will not live more than a few events if you launch w/ any sort of authority.  On launch you can slip one of two things to save your driveline; clutch or tires.  With a race clutch installed tires will generally break loose first to 'cushion' the launch.on gears, CV's, drive & stub axles, not the mention the R&P. Just another reason to use Red Line Shockproof in the 'box too.  If you saw Mark spinning the wheels in 2nd it was on asphalt not concrete; at Peru for example the launch RPM can be quite high to get R25s to spin and not bog.

    How was the 6500 redline achieved for FRCCA; rpm limiter, rotor, or softer than stock valve springs?  With stock valve springs it is not uncommon to go 6800 w/ spikes to 7000 while holding a gear to eliminate a shift.  If nothing else you should be adjusting the valves as part of pre-season prep and checking the ignition components anyway.  I wouldn't let 6500 stick in your head when choosing gears, use the std 6800, but if you have dyno sheets for the motor that is an important data point too.

     



    I have the excel file, and have sent it to Tom.

    Mark wouldn't have been spinning the tires off the line in 2nd gear...
    Dick Rasmussen
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    06 Mar 2011 08:06 PM

    Tom or others:

    Some gears for sale on ApexSpeed:

    http://www.apexspeed.com/forums/sho...hp?t=44597

    I have not checked for "relevancy" of any of the ratios.

    Dick

    Jim G
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    06 Mar 2011 08:13 PM
    Many of those gears are great for autocrossing (no 1st gears though).


    Dick Rasmussen
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    06 Mar 2011 08:17 PM

    Peter's comments are consistent with my experiences also.

    I haven'r run shockproof yet (I now own some and probably will put it in before running the car after the fresh engine goes in) but always run synthetic gear oil.

    FYI my valves hold adjustment very well even though "holding" at 6800 - 7000 is my normal practice. I'm pretty sure I have hardened valve seats.

    I think I'll have fresh valve springs this rebuild.

    FYI: My last rebuild was in about 1998. Previous was 1992. Much more active between 92 and 98 than between 98 and now.

    Iron head and this time lightened flywheel with the Tilton clutch.

    Dick


    t walgamuth
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    06 Mar 2011 09:36 PM

    Thanks guys! We'll continue to digest and see what is available out there.

    Tom

    t walgamuth
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    08 Mar 2011 10:04 PM

    I communicated with the PO and he said there is no rev limiter and the valve springs are stock.

    After more consideration I believe I will take Pete's recommendations for the gearing. I might go for the taller of the two first gears. If I go with a taller series of gears than most folks use I decided I would be giving up acceleration in every gear.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    09 Mar 2011 07:40 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I communicated with the PO and he said there is no rev limiter and the valve springs are stock.

    After more consideration I believe I will take Pete's recommendations for the gearing. I might go for the taller of the two first gears. If I go with a taller series of gears than most folks use I decided I would be giving up acceleration in every gear.

    Peter or others,

    POST UPDATED Due to "not being fully awake when posting earlier":

    Do you think the 13:37 might be too tall with Tom's 10:31 assuming concrete and 25B's? I think that is about 50 mph at 6800. My 13:37 with a 9:31 gives about 45 mph at 6800 rpm . From my experience mid 40's for a first gear is about the limit. For a 10:31 that means the 12:38 I think.

    I'm concerned that even my 45 mph first may be too tall sometimes now that tires are stickier and I'm going to have a lightened flywheel. I've had the racing clutch for many years. Unfortunately I sold my 41 mph first many years ago.

    Dick



    Jim G
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    09 Mar 2011 12:39 PM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:

    I'm concerned that even my 45 mph first may be too tall sometimes now that tires are stickier and I'm going to have a lightened flywheel.

    It'll be fine Dick. No need to worry.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    09 Mar 2011 05:54 PM
    Jim G wrote:
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:

    I'm concerned that even my 45 mph first may be too tall sometimes now that tires are stickier and I'm going to have a lightened flywheel.

    It'll be fine Dick. No need to worry.

    Jim,

    Thanks!

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    09 Mar 2011 10:26 PM
    Decisions, decisions......
    jchiu
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    10 Mar 2011 08:42 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Decisions, decisions......

    Whats wrong with the numbers we came up with? Any luck contacting the seller of those gears?

    t walgamuth
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    15 Mar 2011 05:49 PM

    Ok. I just bought a used gear from one fellow for third gear...17/34, a used second gear 16/36 from another fellow (these are a little too close together so if i could find a little lower second gear I would buy that. And from TRE I got a new 12/38 integral and some lube, sealant and cotter pins! With any luck I'll have those by Friday.

    I wouldn't mind putting them in on Saturday,

    Thanks for all the kind advice.

    t walgamuth
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    15 Mar 2011 05:50 PM
    And whatever I have as first gear currently will be used as fourth at least to start.;)
    t walgamuth
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    16 Mar 2011 07:02 PM
    After thinking about it I ordered a 15/36 gear today.
    t walgamuth
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    20 Mar 2011 03:10 PM

    I am healing nicely from partial knee replacement surgery on the 25th of feb.

    Today we worked on seating position. We are repositioning the seat with the back inclined more forward and closer to the steering wheel so we can both see over the wheel. With it in this position I can just about get a full ninety degrees on the steering if I start with my hands both place high on the wheel, about 2" apart, which is nearly my preferred position any way.

    I have not gotten the 15/36 gear yet. Taylor engineering had to get it from England so it will be next week I hope before I get it.

    I am getting excited to run it on the third.;)

    t walgamuth
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    20 Mar 2011 03:15 PM
    PCalhoun wrote:

    1st 12:38 or 13:37

    2nd 15:36

    3rd 17:34

    4th 19:31

    Are good starting points for a 10:31. Recommend Taylor Race Engineering (TRE) for gear purchases and use of Red Line Shockproof in the 'box. Definitely get a hold of a Hewland gear chart and plot your gears for speed and RPM drop; the chart is available on-line at hewland.com. If you get me your e-mail address I can send you one in Excel next week that is very handy to use; can't figure out how to post an attachment here.

    So this is where we are with the gears except I am not sure what I have in it to use as fourth gear. I am planning to use whatever is in there for first but am not sure what it is yet. If I can find a 19/33 used I will buy that and just sell off whatever gears I am not using.

    This FF deal is pretty cool!

    Jim G
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    20 Mar 2011 08:06 PM
    t walgamuth wrote: We are repositioning the seat with the back inclined more forward and closer to the steering wheel so we can both see over the wheel.

    Check to make sure that the top of your helmet isn't above the main roll hoop.

    jchiu
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    20 Mar 2011 08:14 PM

    Did a brookstick test to verify helmet clearance. No issues on that front.

    t walgamuth
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    23 Mar 2011 06:03 AM
    Althoug Jimmy weighs 150 and I weigh 204 we are nearly the same height so it looks like we can both use the seat in the same position.....which is astonishing!;)
    Locked
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    23 Mar 2011 12:43 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Althoug Jimmy weighs 150 and I weigh 204 we are nearly the same height so it looks like we can both use the seat in the same position.....which is astonishing!;)

    I'm pretty sure Mark and I aren't the same height.

    t walgamuth
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    31 Mar 2011 10:29 PM

    Today we spread the seat to fit my wider load, changed out our gear ratios but noticed as we reinstalled it that we forgot to clean off the gasket material, so we will pull it all out tomrorrow and clean it then reinstall.....amazingly mechanic friendly transmission!

    we also put on brake pads on LF.

    Jimmy was good to go a couple more hours but my knee was complaining and we called it a night!;)

    I found a subdivision where the streets are in and no houses built yet.,...owned by a friend who said we could shake it down there on Saturday!;) We are looking forward to that!

    Locked
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    01 Apr 2011 10:54 AM
    Good to hear.
    t walgamuth
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    02 Apr 2011 08:32 AM
    Unfortunately the gear we have in there for fourth is only good for about three mph more than third! So I will be looking around for one more suitable. The next gear was about 91 mph so fooey!
    t walgamuth
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    02 Apr 2011 05:02 PM

    So we got it all buttoned up and fired the engine and it ran nicely once warmed up. Unfortunately when we went to load it on the trailer it ran a significant amount of oil on the ground. It had collected up in the belly pan and ran out the back when the front of the car tipped up. Now I am pondering pulling the motor to fix it. I don't think the amount of oil is small enough to simply use a pad under it as the PO had said he did last year when running in road races.

    It runs nicely though.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    02 Apr 2011 05:54 PM
    Tom,

    Do you know where the oil is leaking from?

    FYI my car is completely back together except for alignment after changing the wishbones and track/tierod rod ends and installing a new rev limiter. Then I'll inspect the gears and replace the shifter seal.

    Then a six week layoff due to minor surgery later this month :-(

    Dick
    CM 85
    t walgamuth
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    02 Apr 2011 07:59 PM
    It is coming from the curved portion of the "pan" seal. The factory manual says the "pan" is to be assembled with no "pan" gasket just sealer and this engine has a cork gasket there so the gap at the curved portion is excessive making for a leak....presumably.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    02 Apr 2011 09:55 PM
    Tom,

    You might want to double check on the cork end seals. They may be needed for both the rear and front "semi circles".

    The guys on Apexspeed would know "for sure".

    t walgamuth
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    03 Apr 2011 05:11 AM

    The curved seal is required but the long ones on the sides are not. Since the straight ones are installed they cause excessive space for the curved seals, thus the leak.

    Now I am pondering if it is possible to cut away some of the curved seal and its sealer material and create a groove and apply in the groove some sort of epoxy or something which will seal it off. It should not be true oil pressure, just splashing, right?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    03 Apr 2011 08:39 AM
    Tom,

    Is your thought to squeeze some sealant into the leak area and the reason for cutting the curved seal is to allow space to do that? If so, that makes sense IF the leak is from that source. However, there is a good chance the dry sump pan has some internal pressure from blow by and/or normal crankcase pressure so don't get your hopes up too high. If you can do this with the engine in the car it could be worth the effort. Plus you can run the engine first to see how bad the leak actually is.

    Plus your front seal might be the leak source.


    My engine builder is currently using and recommending Permatex Ultra Grey Rigid RTV for the pan and other RTV applications. http://www.permatex.com/documents/t.../82194.pdf

    I don't think epoxy would be good.

    If you pull the motor you might go ahead and pull the pan and do it right. Replace the rear main seal while you are at it. My engine builder had to do this after a brand new rear main leaked like a sieve at first startup in 1998 (he didn't have a dyno then so the engine was already in the car (not fun but at least I remembered what I had to do to remove and reinstall it).

    FYI my engine also does not use pan gaskets. Just the curved seals. There is no header gasket either. Just high temp RTV. This requires a "flat" flange of course.

    The joys of used cars, even used race cars.

    Edit to change "rear" to "front" after reading your Apexspeed post.


    Dick Rasmussen
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    03 Apr 2011 09:02 AM
    Tom,

    Does your car have a mechanical tach drive on the front cover? If so, they can leak and drip down. The mounting area is flexible and even if the bolts are tight it can still leak. My engine builder had me run a small bead of Ultra Grey completely around by adapter after seeing a leak after the dyno runs.

    From the sounds of your leak this is likely but . . .
    t walgamuth
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    04 Apr 2011 08:04 PM
    It looks to be coming out the curved pan seal. So the gray seal is better than the blue? I can go get some.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    04 Apr 2011 08:57 PM
    Tom,

    Apparently the grey is more rigid but is still flexible. Whether or not you can get a good seal given that the area is oil soaked I don't know. Maybe you can spray brake cleaner into the area and after it dries give the sealant a try.

    Have you been able to watch how fast it drips with the engine running?
    nutty944
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    04 Apr 2011 10:13 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    It looks to be coming out the curved pan seal. So the gray seal is better than the blue? I can go get some.

    Ultra Gray is good stuff! Areas still have to be clean before application, but is definitely the best RTV for engine applications.

    thedrumm
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    07 Apr 2011 10:38 AM

    Sorry to bust in, but apparently we don't have messaging on this new forum, that blows.

    Jimmy, can you e-mail me when you have time. Thanks Ted thedrumm@comcast.net

    t walgamuth
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    09 Apr 2011 06:04 PM

    No worries, Ted!

    Today I took the FF down to Mark Lamms and we discovered that the larger diameter gears needed for autocrossing were hitting the bronze shift arm and preventing it from going into third gear. So Mark took that down and put it back together. I am looking forward to running next sunday at Grissom!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    09 Apr 2011 06:59 PM
    Tom,

    Your post brings back memories from 1993 when I ran into that problem with a 17:34 in the 3rd gear position (it has been a second many times with my 9:31 r&p including from 1998). The solution from experts including Craig Taylor was to grind the fork for clearance . . . so I did. I don't recall and my notes don't say whether I used a file or a grinding wheel.

    FYI I opened up my trans for the first time since 1998 ("only" the equivalent of about 5 full seasons of autocrossing including Pro Solos) and everything was just fine using normal synthetic (Valvoline probably). Replaced with Redline Shockproof. My notes say that in the early years I would try as many as 4 different gearing options in one year. I never did what Peter Raymond did at at least one Pro Solo which was to change ratios between days (even though he was leading) because he wanted a slightly different one. Or what Tommy Saunders and Stu Lumpkin had to do after breaking the trans on launch at a Pro (in front of me). The only drive train part I've ever broken, even with a bunch of Pro Solo starts on high grip surfaces, was one half shaft at a local event where one wheel hit a hole and then got grip suddenly on the other side of the hole with high revs in first gear. Very clean break. Got high strength shafts and no more breaks.

    Everything is back together in my car . . . too bad I'l have a couple of month forced layoff due to surgery.

    Fresh engine, shiny suspension parts, fresh paint on frame, fresh rod ends, spiffy clean everywhere (until the first wet tow on an open trailer in the rain or the first runs on a wet course). Considering very little has been needed since I did all this stuff and much more in 91/92 and used the car hard until 2002 that is not too shabby.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    09 Apr 2011 11:02 PM

    yeah.

    I had a partial knee replacement 2.25.11. It is now fully healed on the outside and working very well with full range of motion and less pain walking in years. It still is slightly tender around the wound area and it gets sore but today I was on my feet at Mark's for about four hours on concrete without trouble.

    The loss of conditioning is still apparent since it has been six weeks since I was able to fully exercise but that is getting better too with a lot of walking.

    I am looking forward to next week!

    Mark used a hand rat tail file, and a hand held air grinder to trim it down. He is a marvelously skilled craftsman.

    It is encouraging that you have had so little in the way of major part failures. In my car with the 10/31 diff we need more aggessive gears to get the same final drive ratio.

    Clemens
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    10 Apr 2011 09:12 AM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:

    FYI I opened up my trans for the first time since 1998 ("only" the equivalent of about 5 full seasons of autocrossing including Pro Solos) and everything was just fine using normal synthetic (Valvoline probably). Replaced with Redline Shockproof.

    What grade Shockproof do you guys run in the Hewlands? I checked the Redline Web site, but could not decide between the Lightweight and Super-Lightweight, but was leaning towards Lightweight. The Racer Parts Wholesale Web site a a little additional info:

    Heavy Shockproof Gear Oil:

    -Film thickness greater than an SAE 75W250, yet low fluid friction like 75W90
    -For heavily-loaded racing differentials and transmissions, problem gearboxes
    -Many performance racing applications like Sprint/Midget/Dirt Late Model Differentials, Detroit Lockers and spools, NHRA Top Fuel and Funny Car rear ends
    -Not recommended for most synchro applications due to the product's extreme slipperiness

    Nah, that's not it.

    Lightweight Shockproof Gear Oil:

    -Film thickness greater than an SAE 75W140, yet low fluid friction like 80W gear oil or 30W motor oil
    -Excellent low-temp flow, improved cold shifting
    -For racing differentials under moderate loads
    -Popular in racing transmissions like Hewland and other Road Racing dog-ring boxes, Bert and Brinn for Stock Cars, G-Force, and Liberty clutchless for Drag Racing

    Hmm, maybe this would work for an MK9 in a small formula car.

    Super-Lightweight Shockproof Gear Oil:

    -Film thickness greater than an SAE 75W90, yet low fluid friction like ATF
    -Used in low-power dog-ring racing transaxles with moderate to low load, qualifying, etc.
    -Popular in British F3, Euro F3 and Star Mazda racing gearboxes for ultra low drag

    Well, I think an F3 car has more power than mine, and autocrossing does not put that much run-time on the gearbox. Maybe this is it. I also checked the Hewland manual, which, I think, said to use 90-weight oil. With that info, I bought the Super-Lightweight for my car. Is that consistent with what you guys run in your C-Mods?

    Clemens

    Dick Rasmussen
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    10 Apr 2011 09:00 PM
    Clemens,

    I used Lightweight because that is what Pete Calhoun recommended . . . I think. Previously (i.e. the last almost 20 years) I used 75W-90 synth . . . usually Valvoline.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    10 Apr 2011 09:03 PM

    I used what the fellow I bought the gears from recommended....taylor racing? I think it was what Clemens bought too. I'd go look but I am in Ohio tonight.

    jchiu
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    11 Apr 2011 01:38 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    yeah.

    I had a partial knee replacement 2.25.11. It is now fully healed on the outside and working very well with full range of motion and less pain walking in years. It still is slightly tender around the wound area and it gets sore but today I was on my feet at Mark's for about four hours on concrete without trouble.

    The loss of conditioning is still apparent since it has been six weeks since I was able to fully exercise but that is getting better too with a lot of walking.

    I am looking forward to next week!

    Mark used a hand rat tail file, and a hand held air grinder to trim it down. He is a marvelously skilled craftsman.

    It is encouraging that you have had so little in the way of major part failures. In my car with the 10/31 diff we need more aggessive gears to get the same final drive ratio.

    I feel like we discussed something regarding to the shift fork contacting the gear when we pulled the gearbox apart. Good to hear Mark hooked you up and got her sorted (thanks from me too Mark!).

    Did the permatex and relocation of the valve cover breather fix the oil leak issue? I'm super busy this week but I'd still like to get a shakedown if you're game.

    GChambers
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    11 Apr 2011 11:52 PM
    I got the Van Diemen put back together this weekend. It should be ready to go. I just have a few more things I need to take care of before we can get the car out to an event. Hopefully I'll get that stuff taken care of this week.
    t walgamuth
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    12 Apr 2011 06:38 AM
    Good luck G!
    t walgamuth
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    14 Apr 2011 06:26 AM
    Tonight I am going to work on the seating position some more. I still am really tight across my upper arms and shoulders. Mark suggested either moving my seat back or removing it and simply padding the cockpit. we need to work on getting some lead in and out for Jimmy's ballast too.
    jchiu
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    14 Apr 2011 09:03 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Tonight I am going to work on the seating position some more. I still am really tight across my upper arms and shoulders. Mark suggested either moving my seat back or removing it and simply padding the cockpit. we need to work on getting some lead in and out for Jimmy's ballast too.

    What does the car weigh now without the driver? I was under the impression that as it stands I'd make 1100 without ballast.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    14 Apr 2011 05:04 PM

    FYI regarding lead. When my wife ran our car I used lead sheets that could be "molded" to conform to the curved cover over the fire bottle area of our 85 VD. The sheets were wrapped in a towel. Her legs and the seat belt combined with the fire bottle cover secured the lead adequately for autox. We also had an additional vinyl cover 2 part foam insert to move her forward in the seat shell from the insert I use which is secured to the seat shell. Since she is shorter than me her shoulders still fit under the forward sloping roll bar braces and her helmet stayed under the "broomstick" test.


    Dick
    Clemens
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    14 Apr 2011 05:14 PM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:
    FYI regarding lead. When my wire ran our car....

    Dick

    Dick,

    She must be quite skinny if you call her wire. ;)

    Clemens

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    14 Apr 2011 06:29 PM
    Clemens,

    Thanks for the head up! No she was not and is not skinny or fat. Perfect is a much better description. !

    Typo corrected above. :-)

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    14 Apr 2011 08:11 PM
    jchiu wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Tonight I am going to work on the seating position some more. I still am really tight across my upper arms and shoulders. Mark suggested either moving my seat back or removing it and simply padding the cockpit. we need to work on getting some lead in and out for Jimmy's ballast too.

    What does the car weigh now without the driver? I was under the impression that as it stands I'd make 1100 without ballast.

    According to Ron's notes it weighed last time out about 1115 with him at 180# in it. I guess you would need 20 or so # to make weight unless we get it light enough for me to be at the minimum. My plan is to not concentrate on weight reduction until we have the car up and running and reliable.

    Last night i bought a pull pit wagon, fire extinguisher and odds and ends. I think I have the crankcase ventilatin solved too.

    PCalhoun
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    14 Apr 2011 08:24 PM

    I use Red Line Lightweight Shockproof the "aqua green" stuff, which is what TRE recomended when they blueprinted the 'box back on my old Reynard; i.e. the Bullis car for sale.

    Clemens for reference a current gen F3 engine is about 210 hp, they have a huge air restrictor on them choking them down. That hp number has been pretty accurate for the last 10+ years.

    BTW guys get your cars together and get on down to Atlanta for the Tour in 3 weeks.

    t walgamuth
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    14 Apr 2011 10:07 PM
    heh! we'll see.
    Clemens
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    15 Apr 2011 07:38 AM
    PCalhoun wrote:

    BTW guys get your cars together and get on down to Atlanta for the Tour in 3 weeks.

    Well, it wouldn't be in CM, though. ;)

    Clemens

    adrenalin junkie
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    15 Apr 2011 10:10 AM
    You guys just don't know how fortunate you are, having all the Mod cars in your region. I'm the only CMod, a RF88, in the Gulf Coast Region. For that matter, there isn't one here, Wiregrass Region, Mississippi Region, or Delta Region (New Orleans). I just bought the car in nearly completed condition. Any setup advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks
    - Ed
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    15 Apr 2011 10:18 AM
    Clemens wrote:
    PCalhoun wrote:

    BTW guys get your cars together and get on down to Atlanta for the Tour in 3 weeks.

    Well, it wouldn't be in CM, though. ;)

    Clemens

    You do have a CM in your garage. I'm sure the owner wouldn't mind. :)

    Put mine in the trailer with you, call stone, split gas, have a ball.

    Clemens
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    15 Apr 2011 05:52 PM
    Locked wrote:

    You do have a CM in your garage. I'm sure the owner wouldn't mind. :)

    Put mine in the trailer with you, call stone, split gas, have a ball.

    I have a CM in the garage? Hmm, oh yeah, that one! I had to think about that statement for a while since I had forgotten about that car. Too many cars to keep track of. In fact, I don't really keep track of that one. It just sits there until the owner wants it back.

    Sure, it would be fun. However, that would be too much playing time for me. I have cars I need to work and and drive. I have enough major road trips coming up.

    Clemens

    Dick Rasmussen
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    15 Apr 2011 06:51 PM
    adrenalin junkie wrote:
    You guys just don't know how fortunate you are, having all the Mod cars in your region. I'm the only CMod, a RF88, in the Gulf Coast Region. For that matter, there isn't one here, Wiregrass Region, Mississippi Region, or Delta Region (New Orleans). I just bought the car in nearly completed condition. Any setup advice would be greatly appreciated.

    Thanks
    - Ed

    Ed,

    Just ask! Also, if you haven't done so already check Apexspeed. You can find many of us there and PM from there.

    Many aspects of the RF88 may be similar to an RF85 so "show and tell pictures" from Nick or I may help you in some ways. Plus Apexspeed road racers will have info since I'm sure there are some FF or FC guys there with RF87/88's.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    17 Apr 2011 11:12 PM

    So today we managed to show up at our first autocross of the year and the first for our car. After our tenative start before it was a relief that nothing failed (except a tail pipe extendor fell off not unexpectedly), nothing leaked and we were able to get in our full four runs each.

    We had a hard time starting the car this morning and I will need to remember in the future to start the car the day before. Also I need to get the proper connections for my booster battery so we can use it on every start. I don't think my temp gauge is working because it never moved all day....starting at about 105 and staying there all day. the oil temp gauge though responded to the situation appropriately.

    We ran without a seat today and used padding only. It looks like we will need to do the molded one with one for each of us. Although I was wedged in and never slid even a fraction of an inch we had to add styrofoam around Jimmy when he drove to keep him from sliding around.

    These FF are amazingly fun and challanging to drive.....plenty of power to overpower the grip and lightning quick steering to catch the tail when it steps out.

    Great fun. Great course Larry. A bit trickier than your last course though.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    18 Apr 2011 07:30 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    We had a hard time starting the car this morning and I will need to remember in the future to start the car the day before. Also I need to get the proper connections for my booster battery so we can use it on every start. I don't think my temp gauge is working because it never moved all day....starting at about 105 and staying there all day. the oil temp gauge though responded to the situation appropriately.

    Tom,

    Glad to hear you are off to a good start . . . except for starting the car. One trick I use is to hold the palm of my hand over the carb to function as a choke when the car hasn't been started for a week or so and on a cold morning at a site. I also turn the idle screw in a couple of turns since one hand is on the carb and the other is pushing the start button. I use street gas so it lights off fairly easily.

    Is/are your rads accessible so that you can feel it/them for heat? Do you have a thermostat? I understand it was a cold day there. If the temp gauge is mechanical the capillary tubes fail (been there done that).

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    18 Apr 2011 09:46 AM

    Yeah, I used my hand but the carb bowl was dry and eventually I flooded the carbs but when I determined that I held open the throttle and it started.

    There is mixed thoughts on the thermostat. I am inclined to put one in with holes drilled so that some flow happens but some folks think it is not needed and is a potential place for failure by sticking.

    The radiators felt warm enough that I could only hold my hand on them for a few seconds.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    18 Apr 2011 12:04 PM

    I ran a 160 thermostat with no holes from 92 to 2010 with no problems. I've also never had one stick closed on the street. Buy a major brand like Stant. This time my engine builder suggested I use a 180 with 2 holes . . . so I did. The holes made filling the system easier (previously I wedged it open with a long thin screwdriver) and allows some circulation with the engine off. I restart once or twice to move hot water from the engine to the side rads if temps are high.


    On the bowl being dry. Yep. I have to run the car to position it for loading so I do the "get it happy after a week or more" start early enough to have time to top off the battery before a quick start to load. I don't use a jumper battery. Just a 20 Ah on board.

    Dick
    Locked
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    18 Apr 2011 01:29 PM

    Yesterday when we left the car running between runs we could leave the line with water temps in the 195 range. That would drop to 165 as we crossed the finish line. If we didn't leave it running temps were in the 125-130s and only up to about 160 when leaving the line.

    Tom, we always try to leave the line with water temps above 180 and below 210 as a max. Yesterday was COLD!

    t walgamuth
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    18 Apr 2011 02:21 PM
    The oil temp was reading 180.
    Jim G
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    20 Apr 2011 12:49 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    There is mixed thoughts on the thermostat. I am inclined to put one in with holes drilled so that some flow happens but some folks think it is not needed and is a potential place for failure by sticking.

    The "thermostats will fail" advice should be resisted. We need to get our temps up in order for efficient engine running. I had problems until I gave in and ignored the people who told me not to run a thermostat. YMMV.

    Jim

    t walgamuth
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    23 Apr 2011 05:50 PM

    Today I installed a t stat 180 degree with two 1/8" holes drilled in the disc. I also installed a resonator from my Miata which weighs I estimate about 5#. We were under the decible limit....just... last week so this should give us a bit of cushion.

    I also softened the sway bars front and rear for a bit more grip, I hope.

    And I ordered an additional fitting for the jump start set up so I can use the fast plug instead of having to pull the nose to jump the car. After sitting one week the carb still had fuel in it and the car started right up.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    23 Apr 2011 08:49 PM
    Tom,

    As cold as it was for your first event I'm surprised you had any grip. Cold air and cold pavement are not good for even 25B grip afaik.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    24 Apr 2011 01:01 PM

    It was about like driving on snow. My co driver, Jimmy spun four times in his first two runs. I spun once on my third attempt on a turn I have since figured out was a slight reverse camber, but I spun pretty comprehensively!

    Today I am going to take some spacers out of the rack to get some more steering lock.

    My starter sounds like it is coming apart and if it partially fires will disengage. I suspect a new bendix is in order. So most of you run a standard pinto starter or is there a lighter option available?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    24 Apr 2011 06:03 PM

    Tom,

    A couple of thoughts:

    For steering see if you can get a turning diameter similar to a Mustang, etc. which is a little tighter than 40 feet. My car was 50 feet at first and that was terrible.

    For many of us, rear tires go off faster than fronts. Old tires are even worse in cold conditions than in warm weather. Below 50 for me was terrible.

    For the starter there are lots of options. I'll email you a picture of mine but I don't know what your options are.

    Don't worry yet about the handling. A healthy set of 25B's on clean warm pavement will be wonderful. :-)

    Dick

    CM85

    t walgamuth
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    24 Apr 2011 07:52 PM

    I bought some shelf worn but new Hankook slicks in sorta the right size just to get a few events in and get some seat time before putting on the high priced tires. They are a pretty hard compound and are a little on the narrow side. In addition the rears are not cantilevered so the sidewalls are pretty pinched in.

    I'm looking forward to getting on some good tires.

    Locked
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    24 Apr 2011 08:42 PM
    Spins! Ha.. I went 2 total events last year without spinning the Dulon.
    GChambers
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    25 Apr 2011 11:40 AM
    I spun at the 2nd gate on my first run last weekend.
    jchiu
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    25 Apr 2011 01:40 PM
    "I'm not quite sure this is the line I'm supposed to take..."



    Dick Rasmussen
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    25 Apr 2011 06:48 PM

    You guys in Indy must be masters at two feet in with all the practice you get! No wonder you need to use a jump battery on grid. You have to save the on board for "on course" restarts. <grin>

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    26 Apr 2011 02:33 AM
    Well, yeah. After watching Jimmy trying to get through the first little slalom section right after the start I knew I had to take that section carefully. ;) ...and every other section.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    26 Apr 2011 06:41 AM
    I've learned that if I cannot go to full throttle in second gear after short shifting that I have NO traction. Usually happens in the wet on slicks but experienced at least once in less that 50 degree temps on somewhat old tires. :-) Normally, of course, full throttle is no problem in first gear and with decent tires and good grip lots of revs are needed to prevent bog. Pro Solo was FUN!

    Dick
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    26 Apr 2011 10:04 AM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:

    You guys in Indy must be masters at two feet in with all the practice you get! No wonder you need to use a jump battery on grid. You have to save the on board for "on course" restarts.

    Dick

    I prefer to forget to get the clutch in that way I'm sitting both backward, and with a silent motor.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    26 Apr 2011 12:13 PM

    Hence the need for saving the on board battery . At least with a silent motor you get to think about what went wrong and course workers can hear your "comments". Been there done that (not as often as you apparently), scuffed the rubber buildup off one section of all four tires. <grin>

    t walgamuth
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    27 Apr 2011 07:08 PM

    Anybody have any lead for sale?

    We need 50# ballast for Jimmy. Any other ideas?

    nutty944
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    27 Apr 2011 07:23 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Anybody have any lead for sale?

    We need 50# ballast for Jimmy. Any other ideas?

    What size/shape do you need? I might have some pieces of steel that could fit the bill.

    t walgamuth
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    27 Apr 2011 10:15 PM

    oh roughly 12" x 14" x 1". I can get an exact dimension if you have anything close.

    Thanks!

    Tonight I drained the fuel tank so I can get a handle on how much fuel I have in it. I also changed the fuel filter and checked the carb bowl for dirt. It was clean as a whistle. Then I noticed a fitting under the needle valve and removed it to find a lovely little strainer with copper mesh in a plastic frame. it had some dirt in it. I cleaned that and reassembled it all.

    Ya gotta love the simple quality design and build of a Webar carb!

    nutty944
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    27 Apr 2011 10:41 PM
    I'll dig around the shop tomorrow and let you know if I have anything that will work.
    t walgamuth
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    28 Apr 2011 06:24 AM
    Thanks Chris!
    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Apr 2011 07:14 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    oh roughly 12" x 14" x 1". I can get an exact dimension if you have anything close.

    Thanks!

    Tonight I drained the fuel tank so I can get a handle on how much fuel I have in it. I also changed the fuel filter and checked the carb bowl for dirt. It was clean as a whistle. Then I noticed a fitting under the needle valve and removed it to find a lovely little strainer with copper mesh in a plastic frame. it had some dirt in it. I cleaned that and reassembled it all.

    Ya gotta love the simple quality design and build of a Webar carb!

    Tom,

    Pay very close attention to the air correction jets. They can easily get crud in them. :-(

    Dick

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    28 Apr 2011 07:15 AM

    Duplicate post


    Clemens
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    28 Apr 2011 12:36 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Anybody have any lead for sale?

    We need 50# ballast for Jimmy. Any other ideas?

    Tom,

    I initially bought some lead on eBay, but not nearly enough (I run 120 lbs+ of ballast in the LeGrand alone). I started going to tire stores with a big bucket and got their old balancing weights. One charged me a nominal fee, another gave them to me for free. I melted them down on a propane burner, fished out the metal clips, and poured the lead into a cheap aluminum foil pan I purchased at the dollar store to make lead plates. I also poured some directly into the car (unlike when pouring the epoxy foam for my seat, I wasn't sitting in the car when I did that).

    You can also buy lead sheets, bars, ingots, cakes, etc. at places like McMaster-Carr, but you'd pay hundreds of dollars.

    If you need help melting lead, I can help.

    Clemens

    t walgamuth
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    28 Apr 2011 03:34 PM
    I'll have to get out my weber book and see which things you speak of.
    t walgamuth
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    28 Apr 2011 03:37 PM

    I remember watching my dad melt lead for cast iron pipe drain lines in our house he built when I was a tot. About 1950 to 52.;)

    I might want to borrow your melter or come down and use it.

    Thasnk very much!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Apr 2011 06:23 PM
    Tom,

    The air correction jets are the ones above the emulsion tubes. The jets are items 79 and 79-A in the Pegasus illustration.

    Dick
    nutty944
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    28 Apr 2011 06:30 PM
    Clemens wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Anybody have any lead for sale?

    We need 50# ballast for Jimmy. Any other ideas?

    Tom,

    I initially bought some lead on eBay, but not nearly enough (I run 120 lbs+ of ballast in the LeGrand alone). I started going to tire stores with a big bucket and got their old balancing weights. One charged me a nominal fee, another gave them to me for free. I melted them down on a propane burner, fished out the metal clips, and poured the lead into a cheap aluminum foil pan I purchased at the dollar store to make lead plates. I also poured some directly into the car (unlike when pouring the epoxy foam for my seat, I wasn't sitting in the car when I did that).

    You can also buy lead sheets, bars, ingots, cakes, etc. at places like McMaster-Carr, but you'd pay hundreds of dollars.

    If you need help melting lead, I can help.

    Clemens

    We have a whole bunch of used wheel weights I could snag on to. Don't know if it'll be enough, but I can also ask my tire delivery guy if he could save some back.

    Otherwise, I wasn't able to find anything. Let me know if you want me to snag the weights for you, Tom.

    t walgamuth
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    28 Apr 2011 10:43 PM

    That sounds really good, Chris!

    Thanks very much!

    Jim G
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    28 Apr 2011 11:02 PM
    While I don't recall where I purchased it, I bought a heavy piece of sheet lead a couple years ago. I found it thru a simple google search.

    Prior to that, I used a piece of lead pipe, threaded and screw capped. Filled it with lead pellets.
    pru
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    29 Apr 2011 08:37 AM

    I have a 11"x13"x1" piece of flat steel that weighs 40.5#. It's a hold over from my BM FF2000. As others have done, I used the steel as the base of a two part seat (i.e. place the steel between the frame rail / pour the two-part foam around it). I went with steel as it was quickly available and cheap not to mention that I did not need to do any special fab work to use it (the steel supplier cut it to size when I purchased).

    FYI: #/cu' of rolled steel is 495#... #/cu' of cast lead is 708#...That is, rolled steel is ~70% the weight of cast lead...

    jchiu
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    29 Apr 2011 09:06 AM
    We need to make sure that the ballast can be installed and removed quickly and securely during driver changes too.

    Plate steel will probably work if we can get it cut to the size/shape of the floor between the rails under the driver, then possibly some rotational tabs on the frame to make sure it doesn't move vertically and can be quickly locked into place? I'm guessing we would need to weld on some handles to make it easier to lift in and out of the car too.

    t walgamuth
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    29 Apr 2011 09:18 AM
    Yes, I am picturing a rectangular weight that fits between the frame rails with some sort of quick release fastener using tabs that lap over onto the frame.
    Locked
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    29 Apr 2011 01:20 PM
    Jimmy, have you thought about eating a couple extra cheeseburgers this week?
    t walgamuth
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    29 Apr 2011 02:02 PM
    heh!
    jchiu
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    29 Apr 2011 06:56 PM
    Locked wrote:
    Jimmy, have you thought about eating a couple extra cheeseburgers this week?

    Maybe if they were made of tungsten alloy... Slim Jim hits the gym 5-6 days a week, those cheeseburgers won't do a damn thing.

    t walgamuth
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    29 Apr 2011 10:04 PM
    Anybody got any extra four lug wheels? Alloy preferred. I have four extra steel wheels and one is bent so one steel one would be nice too.
    nutty944
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    29 Apr 2011 11:09 PM
    Tom- I have a bucket of wheel weights loaded up, it weighs about 58lbs or so, so without the bucket weight and the metal clips, it should be close to 50lbs of lead. I'll have it with me up at Grissom over the weekend.
    t walgamuth
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    30 Apr 2011 07:23 AM

    That sounds really good Chris!

    Thanks very much!

    t walgamuth
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    30 Apr 2011 08:25 AM
    Today I want to assemble my cables for my jump battery. I have these connectors which are simply round sleeves to slip the cable into which require crimping. Do these require a special crimping tool or can I do it with vise grips? a bench vise? a large hammer? (just kidding about the hammer.....unless it works!)
    Dick Rasmussen
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    30 Apr 2011 08:59 AM
    https://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/...p;amp;An=0

    If the link works, this is a relatively inexpensive "impact" crimper that you might be able to find today. Basically insert cable/connector. Hit HARD with hammer.

    Try this link for a picture if the link doesn't work. It looks like my local Napa has it in stock so you might be able to find one today.

    http://www.atlweldingsupply.com/Ham...-2699.html


    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    30 Apr 2011 09:07 AM
    Thanks Dick! I'll check that out!
    t walgamuth
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    30 Apr 2011 09:35 PM

    I went to napa reluctantly resigned to buying a crimper and they offered to crimp it for me, so now I have an excellent looking jumper setup. I also bought a smaller battery which I expected to save at least 10# but it only saved 6. It has equal power to my other lawn mower battery though!

    I figured out how to secure the ballast Jimmy will be needing.

    t walgamuth
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    01 May 2011 06:58 PM

    Chris delivered a most impressive load of wheel weights today at the autocross. I need to get this ballast going quickly so Jimmy can be legal.

    The fact that he is beating my pants off has nothing to do with it, I am only worried about his soul.;)

    The car worked better today with both bars unhooked, but I think I need a small bar on front to balanc it out. It is still a bit tail happy. I am guessing they have them on Pegasus. Today we ran out of fuel twice. I am going to have to get a better handle on how much fuel it holds!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    01 May 2011 08:32 PM
    Tom,

    One trick for keeping track of how much fuel is in the cell is a dipstick system. I use a pvc pipe tube with many holes to allow fuel in/out to make a clear path through the foam. I use a fuel hose since flexibility is needed in my car due to a bend between the filler tube and the cell. The hose was calibrated by starting with an empty cell and adding one gallon at a time. I use tywraps for markings on the hose. My pvc tube has a plumbing cap on the end to "round" the edges of the pipe to avoid cutting into the cell bottom. The black fuel hose shows the wet fuel well. It lives in the tube/cell.

    Dick
    jchiu
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    01 May 2011 09:36 PM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:
    Tom,

    One trick for keeping track of how much fuel is in the cell is a dipstick system. I use a pvc pipe tube with many holes to allow fuel in/out to make a clear path through the foam. I use a fuel hose since flexibility is needed in my car due to a bend between the filler tube and the cell. The hose was calibrated by starting with an empty cell and adding one gallon at a time. I use tywraps for markings on the hose. My pvc tube has a plumbing cap on the end to "round" the edges of the pipe to avoid cutting into the cell bottom. The black fuel hose shows the wet fuel well. It lives in the tube/cell.

    Dick

    Tom's car already has the fuel hose down the filler tube for the dip stick. He's just misplaced the wooden dip stick that the PO gave him with the car.

    t walgamuth
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    01 May 2011 09:51 PM
    True. I just realized about the hose inside the filler neck. I had not been aware of that detail. Because of that I wondered how the stick would ever penetrate the foam and give a good reading. I'll have to dig out the dipstick and do the filling one gallon at a time thing and mark the stick.
    t walgamuth
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    02 May 2011 05:55 AM
    Anybody know where I can buy a smaller front sway bar for my car?
    pru
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    02 May 2011 08:59 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Anybody know where I can buy a smaller front sway bar for my car?

    I would start with Larry Oliver at International Racing Products (http://www.formulacars.com/). He stocks a lot of Reynard parts and may have what you need on the shelf...

    Locked
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    02 May 2011 09:17 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Anybody know where I can buy a smaller front sway bar for my car?

    Tom! Do yourself a big favor.. Don't make a single setup change until you've put the correct tires on the car at a minimum. It also needs aligned. Spend your $$ on the important stuff 1st.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    02 May 2011 09:29 AM
    Locked wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Anybody know where I can buy a smaller front sway bar for my car?

    Tom! Do yourself a big favor.. Don't make a single setup change until you've put the correct tires on the car at a minimum. It also needs aligned. Spend your $$ on the important stuff 1st.

    Ditto. Truer words were never said. :-)

    A setup that worked for road racing is going to be very close to what will suit your style for autocrossing . . . after you guys get to the point where you are comfortable in the car and can drive it close to the limit. When I look through my notes I'm amazed at how many changes I tried in the first years that really didn't make more than minor differences compared to simply working on my driving . . .

    Dick


    t walgamuth
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    02 May 2011 01:44 PM

    We really need a test and tune but I have a conflict next weekend!

    Would someone ask Clemens to email me at twalgamuth@comcast.net, please? I want to arrange to use his lead melter.

    GChambers
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    02 May 2011 01:48 PM

    Ben and I, other than just a small sway bar adjustment today, mostly because I didn't like how it was mounted, haven't changed a single thing on our car. It isn't even aligned. I don't see changing anything either until we get a new set of Hoosiers. There just isn't any sense in doing it.

    Honestly though, we're both very happy with the way the car drives and handles. It's very predictible and generally behaves very well even on these old shitty tires.

    t walgamuth
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    02 May 2011 02:53 PM
    We are tail happy.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    02 May 2011 03:40 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    We are tail happy.

    With wrong size who knows how sticky Hancook whatever tires on a very cold day. :-) <grin> What about with reasonably fresh 25B's on a decent day? That is what counts. With the Hancooks just practice car control, shifting, getting in/out of the car, changing drivers, numbers, and ballast, etc. <grin>

    Plus I doubt that a different front bar would solve that problem. What it might do is make you think it did if the temp is better the next time you run the car.

    I found that it generally takes several events on good tires to get a feel for the "average" balance of the car in the various situations. I would watch tire wear (easier than a pyrometer) to see whether the fronts were actually working or not since the rears tend to get hot just from normal launch and corner exit wheelspin . . . especially since I did lots of Pro Solos.

    FYI for me and my car as new tires became good tires the car got a little more loose than optimum . . . which became good car control practice since the tires were used for local events by then. :-)

    Remember FF has a 10 lbs per HP power to weight ratio and real short gears and tires with little cold traction or "old" traction.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    02 May 2011 04:47 PM
    So you saying tail happy is normal? (grin)
    jchiu
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    02 May 2011 05:07 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    So you saying tail happy is normal? (grin)

    It didn't feel excessively tail happy to me. Then again, last time out I had understeer and you did not. However I think the advise from everybody here is spot on. Big tweaks first, then fine details.

    I sent you the numbers from the GPS via email, but basically it tells me that had you strung together all of your best sectors in one run and I got all of my best sectors in one run we'd be 0.1seconds apart, and we'd both have clocked close to 49.9s. Sounds like we both badly need that seat time the T+T would have offered.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    02 May 2011 05:57 PM
    Slightly tail happy beats push in my book (grin).

    What you might do, especially if adding 50 lbs of ballast makes the car tail happy for Jimmy, is make sure the rear suspension isn't bottoming or binding in some part of its travel. Rod ends, spherical bearings, etc. don't last forever.

    Dick
    GChambers
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    03 May 2011 09:38 AM

    Tom, what everyone is trying to tell you is THERE'S NO POINT IN CHANGING THE CAR UNTIL YOU GET REAL TIRES ON IT! IF YOU DO, IT WILL JUST NEED TO BE CHANGED AGAIN WHEN YOU DO GET REAL TIRES! STOP MESSING WITH IT AND JUST LEARN TO DRIVE IT AND GET COMFORTABLE LIVING WITH IT!

    Could you hear me or do I need to type a little louder? I can make the font bigger if need be....

    :-)

    t walgamuth
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    03 May 2011 09:41 AM

    I understood everybody's comments clearly even before your post.

    Thanks for your comments though.;)

    Locked
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    03 May 2011 11:05 AM
    Sunday I spun twice.. I was behind the car.. The handling was perfect though.

    Also, when you get to tweaking the car... start with changing springs before you change your sway bars...
    t walgamuth
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    05 May 2011 10:57 PM

    Tonight we weighed the car. it was 944 without a driver. with me 1155 so now my problem is not ballast but taking weight out of the car. That makes ballast seem like a very cheap problem!

    The good news is the cross weights are about as perfect as you could hope for....within 1# in front and within 6 in the rear.

    harts
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    06 May 2011 08:46 AM
    Locked wrote:
    Sunday I spun twice.. I was behind the car.. The handling was perfect though.

    Also, when you get to tweaking the car... start with changing springs before you change your sway bars...

    was one of those spins exiteing the prison turn while on the off camber part

    Locked
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    06 May 2011 10:07 AM
    The spin on my 2nd run was in the very last left hand corner just before the finish. I had the tail out too far in the right hander and caught it, but essentually put the car into a tank slapper by transitioning immediately to the left hander.

    The spin on my 4th run was in the left hander after the 4 cone wallom.. I was much too late in a downshift from 4th gear to 3rd gear and my hands simply weren't quick enough back to the wheel to a countersteer as I drifted around that corner.
    t walgamuth
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    08 May 2011 09:52 AM
    Hoosiers ordered. Now I am looking for some lighter wheels. Anybody have a line on some good used FF wheels for cheap?;)
    Jim G
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    08 May 2011 05:56 PM

    Can be difficult to obtain these days. Panasports are the most popular for their compromise of weight and price (but don't price a new set unless you want to feel your stomach drop).

    Over on apexspeed used wheels get snapped up pretty quickly. But before you start looking, measure your back spacing (and you can let that number be somewhat flexible) and critically, your bolt pattern. You probably know how to do that but here it is again anyway. For a 4 bolt wheel, measure center to center of two holes directly across from each other. My car is 100 mm and it can be tough to find. Other sizes can be easier. I've noticed some are measured in mm, others in inches.


    Good luck!
    Dick Rasmussen
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    08 May 2011 07:14 PM
    I just priced Kodiak wheels on their website. About $408 each wheel unless you buy multiple sets. Then it becomes about $376.

    Unless they have them in stock ready to ship I've heard that the actual lead times can be rather long.

    I "think" the English car bolt pattern is 3 3/4.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    08 May 2011 07:38 PM
    I'm gonna see if I can get a set of panasports shipped here before friday.
    Jim G
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    09 May 2011 12:23 PM
    New?
    GChambers
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    09 May 2011 02:11 PM
    Awesome. You're going to make Ben and I bring our a game.
    t walgamuth
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    09 May 2011 02:50 PM

    I'd love some good used ones...got any?

    t walgamuth
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    09 May 2011 02:51 PM

    G so you were stroking it last time?

    Heh!

    harts
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    09 May 2011 04:31 PM
    Dick Rasmussen wrote:
    I just priced Kodiak wheels on their website. About $408 each wheel unless you buy multiple sets. Then it becomes about $376.

    Unless they have them in stock ready to ship I've heard that the actual lead times can be rather long.

    I "think" the English car bolt pattern is 3 3/4.

    Dick

    i bought some kodiak's for the mini before anyone else was makeing them, it took forever to get them and then they were heavy, and the center hole was about .030 over size,,, never again

    t walgamuth
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    10 May 2011 09:47 PM
    I got a call back on some used Panasports today but cannot get them for a couple of weeks. I am pumped!
    GChambers
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    11 May 2011 01:11 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    G so you were stroking it last time?

    Heh!

    Oh no. We were pushing the car pretty good. We have yet to align it and we are still on 2007 Hoosier A compound slicks with the narrower fronts. If we can get it aligned and get some new tires on it I hope to be running within a second of Nick and Mark.

    t walgamuth
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    11 May 2011 10:14 PM

    So do some folks run the cantilevers on both ends?

    A second? You'll get there! I'd love to too but am not expecting it anytime soon!

    t walgamuth
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    11 May 2011 10:16 PM
    I'll be happy to nip at your heels!
    Dick Rasmussen
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    12 May 2011 08:36 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    So do some folks run the cantilevers on both ends?

    One guy (Ray Thomas?) tried it years ago but it didn't seem to work. The "proven" combo is the FC size fronts and the FF cantilever rear. Currently Hoosier 25B. Given how serious lots of guys are, I'm sure that if a faster combo worked in their private testing it would have shown up at Nationals.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    13 May 2011 04:21 AM
    I would think it would be tough to keep it from oversteering. The SAE cars have both the same but they look to be nearly fifty fifty on weight distribution.
    t walgamuth
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    14 May 2011 04:31 AM

    I;m driving up to South Bend today to get my Hoosiers.;)

    I really wanted to run both days at Gary this weekend but it is not working out for that and looks like rain too. Should be ready to boogy next weekend!

    Jim G
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    14 May 2011 09:06 PM
    I think the problem was that the car wouldn't turn with those huge cantilevered tires at the rear front.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    15 May 2011 06:53 AM
    Jim G wrote:
    I think the problem was that the car wouldn't turn with those huge cantilevered tires at the rear.

    Jim,

    Did you mean to say "at the front" since the cantilevered tires are normal for the rear?

    Other reasons why the big cantilevers might not or did not work: Too big to get enough heat, too stiff for the 100 lbs lighter front corner weights, suspension adjustments to compensate for taller tire height messed up geometry.

    Dick

    CM85

    Jim G
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    15 May 2011 07:33 PM
    Thanks Dick. I'm so used to having the rears at the rear that I just typed it in by mistake.
    t walgamuth
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    18 May 2011 09:44 PM
    I got on the scales this evening and am under 200# for the first in a long time.;)
    Locked
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    19 May 2011 11:29 AM
    It's amazing what motivation a little competition is. :)
    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 May 2011 02:34 PM
    Locked wrote:
    It's amazing what motivation a little competition is. :)

    Especially if the competition is "little" . . . or much lighter :-)

    Dick (need to get below 160 again and better yet down near 150 again)


    t walgamuth
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    21 May 2011 07:23 AM

    The new Knee now feels like the original one on the other side. No pain and it never hurts except to get stiff after sittting for an hour or so. It allows complete freedom of movement including as much walking as I want. I am exercising more and generally feel a lot better. And the weight is still sliding down without too much effort diet wise....just less bread, less potatoes and less fat.

    Yesterday after supper 199.4. This morning before breakfast 196.4.

    I'm gonna just try to keep it moving that way.

    t walgamuth
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    21 May 2011 12:24 PM
    Jimmy and I were looking at the new Hoosiers. Dang! They really look Wide! They look wonderful! Huge round black donuts!
    t walgamuth
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    21 May 2011 05:15 PM
    I worked all day on the car. Fine tuned some things, and reconnected the sway bars. Mounted the wheels and tires. I still have to go get one fastener and some fuel for tomorrow and tie the car down. I hope it does not rain.
    t walgamuth
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    22 May 2011 06:45 PM

    The course today was tricky. I found two places on my first run that I could not turn the steering wheel enough to make the turns. We have to remove the spacers on the rack so we can turn the wheel more. With our new tires and new colors we were expecting a 3 second gain per run (Clemens said the new paint was worth 2 seconds) but alas although we gained on the good guys we still were off the pace by about a second and a half.

    We feel we are gaining though!

    In examining our tires it looks like the rr needs a bit more negative camber. Perhaps I just need to lower that corner a bit. I raised the rear a bit for the hancooks since they're a bit shorter than the hoosiers.

    I hardened the rear sway twice at least, trying to tame the push. It seemed to help. I may harden it a bit more.

    We got rained out on our last two runs. We might need to band together and try to get our leadership to allow cars with no tops to run first when rain is moving in. When it started raining all of our c mod people loaded up their cars for the day.;)

    Eclipse2Lancer
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    22 May 2011 10:08 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    The course today was tricky. I found two places on my first run that I could not turn the steering wheel enough to make the turns. We have to remove the spacers on the rack so we can turn the wheel more. With our new tires and new colors we were expecting a 3 second gain per run (Clemens said the new paint was worth 2 seconds) but alas although we gained on the good guys we still were off the pace by about a second and a half.

    We feel we are gaining though!

    In examining our tires it looks like the rr needs a bit more negative camber. Perhaps I just need to lower that corner a bit. I raised the rear a bit for the hancooks since they're a bit shorter than the hoosiers.

    I hardened the rear sway twice at least, trying to tame the push. It seemed to help. I may harden it a bit more.

    We got rained out on our last two runs. We might need to band together and try to get our leadership to allow cars with no tops to run first when rain is moving in. When it started raining all of our c mod people loaded up their cars for the day.;)

    You play the game, you take those chances Tom. ;-) You need to convince the computer to let you run when you want, as it picks the initial run order for us. We only move around legitimate class requests (3 drivers in a car, ladies class wanting to run with her open class car owner, etc) and for certain specialty workers so we have plenty to cover those spots (Safety, T&S) in each heat. The computer doesn't care if you have a top on your car or not.

    t walgamuth
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    22 May 2011 11:36 PM
    I'll ask Jimmy to talk to the computer. I think he speaks that language a lot better than I do!;)
    GChambers
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    23 May 2011 11:24 AM
    After yesterday our car is a bit of a mess. We bent up the front suspension, got a flat on the rear Hoosier and found quite an oil leak. Looks like it's going to get torn apart over the next few weeks. Hopefully we can have it back together by Blytheville.
    jchiu
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    23 May 2011 01:29 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    I'll ask Jimmy to talk to the computer. I think he speaks that language a lot better than I do!;)




    Steering lock issues should be all resolved now. No more three-point turns to get to the line or back to grid.

    DigDloppyFonkeyBick
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    23 May 2011 02:48 PM
    Eclipse2Lancer wrote: The computer doesn't care if you have a top on or not.

    But we do. ;)

    GChambers
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    23 May 2011 04:28 PM
    DigDloppyFonkeyBick wrote:
    Eclipse2Lancer wrote: The computer doesn't care if you have a top on or not.

    But we do. ;)

    So, you're saying if Tom asks topless you'll listen?

    harts
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    23 May 2011 04:57 PM
    GChambers wrote:
    After yesterday our car is a bit of a mess. We bent up the front suspension, got a flat on the rear Hoosier and found quite an oil leak. Looks like it's going to get torn apart over the next few weeks. Hopefully we can have it back together by Blytheville.

    how did you bend the suspension ??

    t walgamuth
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    23 May 2011 06:02 PM

    I bet I'll have better results if I threaten to take off my shirt!;)

    BTW, I would like to do a couple national tour events but Jimmy is not interested in doing so. So I would be open to sharing my car or someone elses at one or two.

    GChambers
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    23 May 2011 08:59 PM

    Not exactly sure but I'm guessing it was on Ben's first run. There were a few dips in the surface. We tried to change the course so that we didn't hit them straight on. Apparently it didn't help us.

    DigDloppyFonkeyBick
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    23 May 2011 10:08 PM
    GChambers wrote:

    Not exactly sure but I'm guessing it was on Ben's first run. There were a few dips in the surface. We tried to change the course so that we didn't hit them straight on. Apparently it didn't help us.

    I r embarrassed. Fat man in little car.

    t walgamuth
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    23 May 2011 11:00 PM
    Can someone tell us how to break the shift linkage at a u joint? Is there a little set screw in there? We have a main shift rod that needs to come out and be straightened.
    GChambers
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    24 May 2011 11:40 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Can someone tell us how to break the shift linkage at a u joint? Is there a little set screw in there? We have a main shift rod that needs to come out and be straightened.

    Sawzall?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    24 May 2011 12:37 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Can someone tell us how to break the shift linkage at a u joint? Is there a little set screw in there? We have a main shift rod that needs to come out and be straightened.

    Mine have a combination of a set screw and a bolt. I've upsized all set screws to ones with larger heads instead of the tiny ones that are easy to strip. Bolts are 10/32 AN with nylocks.

    My shift rods are solid. I would move up to larger bolts if the rods and universals were bigger diameter.

    t walgamuth
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    24 May 2011 07:17 PM
    Ours is floppy! I like the looks of Nick's.
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    24 May 2011 08:50 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Ours is floppy! I like the looks of Nick's.

    When I said "solid" I meant they are solid rods, not hollow tubes. However, mine is like I assume Nick's is (85 VD) except I still have all the original parts except a few set screws and bolts. I think Nick upgraded the universals and the "bushings" in the cockpit.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    24 May 2011 09:50 PM

    Did anybody post any pictures anywhere of the action on Sunday?

    I'd love a pic of the new paint job. Jimmy calls it "The angry blackbird". I thought at first he meant " The blackbird" Like the SR70. Then he showed me this picture of this little fat blackbird from some video game!

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    25 May 2011 10:39 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Did anybody post any pictures anywhere of the action on Sunday?

    I'd love a pic of the new paint job. Jimmy calls it "The angry blackbird". I thought at first he meant " The blackbird" Like the SR70. Then he showed me this picture of this little fat blackbird from some video game!

    Get some pointy bits on it and lose all the orange and we can call it the SRF-85 :)

    GChambers
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    26 May 2011 10:05 AM

    Shahab came over last night and helped me take the front end apart. What we thought were bent pieces were actually just flexing quite a bit. As we took everything apart it seems that the car just flopped back into shape. Huh... I think I have a good idea of how to keep this from happening again. Fortunately there were enough spares with the car when I bought it that I have the pieces I need to modify and strengthen the front end. Should have it done and back together in a few days.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    26 May 2011 03:22 PM
    I don't know pieces you are referring to but . . .

    Don't make "replaceable" parts so strong that the frame takes it tough if something happens. Well engineered formula cars allow the frame to survive with minimal, if any damage. Even the rod ends are sized to be more likely to bend than wishbones. Take a look at Nick's 85 VD for an example of a car that has a reputation for frame survival. Chances are that your's is also.

    Dick
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    26 May 2011 07:07 PM
    DickR wrote:
    I don't know pieces you are referring to but . . .

    Don't make "replaceable" parts so strong that the frame takes it tough if something happens. Well engineered formula cars allow the frame to survive with minimal, if any damage. Even the rod ends are sized to be more likely to bend than wishbones. Take a look at Nick's 85 VD for an example of a car that has a reputation for frame survival. Chances are that your's is also.

    Dick

    The way the steering rack and the sway bar are mounted is suspect. There is very little support for it. I do understand that it's engineered to allow the frame to survive without damage but we're not crashing into stuff here. It's got to be stiff enough to not flex during an autocross run on an uneven surface. Currently it's not. I'm certain the fix I have in mind will do the job.

    t walgamuth
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    29 May 2011 03:35 PM
    I'm talking to a fellow named Nick over in Illinios that our Nick hooked me up with who wants to run with me at a national tour or two. Perhaps nationals. Toledo seems a sure bet and Blytheville seems worth considering as well. He has not run a CM before so we will try to get a couple events in before running the big ones.
    Clemens
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    31 May 2011 12:02 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    I'm talking to a fellow named Nick over in Illinios that our Nick hooked me up with who wants to run with me at a national tour or two. Perhaps nationals. Toledo seems a sure bet and Blytheville seems worth considering as well. He has not run a CM before so we will try to get a couple events in before running the big ones.

    Tom,

    Blytheville is always a good time. But also look at the Toledo NT, if you have not done so yet. There is potential for CM to hit almost 15 entries. Wow!

    Clemens

    GChambers
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    31 May 2011 05:56 PM
    Clemens wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:
    I'm talking to a fellow named Nick over in Illinios that our Nick hooked me up with who wants to run with me at a national tour or two. Perhaps nationals. Toledo seems a sure bet and Blytheville seems worth considering as well. He has not run a CM before so we will try to get a couple events in before running the big ones.

    Tom,

    Blytheville is always a good time. But also look at the Toledo NT, if you have not done so yet. There is potential for CM to hit almost 15 entries. Wow!

    Clemens

    Tom, definitely make Toledo. If you two go that would make a total of 14 registered. There's 11 now and Ben should get registered in the next few days. You might also want to do so soon. It's probably going to fill up.

    t walgamuth
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    31 May 2011 07:14 PM

    Is there limited number allowed to compete?

    I need a commitment from the co drive before registering, I think.

    Locked
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    31 May 2011 11:01 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Is there limited number allowed to compete?

    I need a commitment from the co drive before registering, I think.

    No limit, the more the merrier.

    DigDloppyFonkeyBick
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    01 Jun 2011 11:13 AM
    Entry is capped at 350. Currently 214 registered.
    t walgamuth
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    03 Jun 2011 09:37 PM
    I am heading out to run at the south bend region pseudo national tour event tomorrow. I will be running for the first time solo. getting my belts fastened may be my biggest problem.
    t walgamuth
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    04 Jun 2011 10:14 PM

    There was not a big turnout so we got six runs each. It was a course that had a FTD of 45.7 or so. It was mr. Lewis in the ground shaking CP camaro. I had second fastest raw time of 46.8 or so. The course was laid out crossing the asphalt strips at least six times. Some of them were a concern in the Cmod since they stuck up. I did not drag on them but they were very jarring.

    I forgot my driving shoes so I had to use masking tape and corrogated cardboard on my feet to drive since my normal shoes are way too wide to drive the c mod in competition.

    I got help with my belts from Gus and Larry Harts but just stayed in the car between runs excepting between the fourth and fifth when I got out and fiddled a little too much with the car. Next run I spun out three times. So I had one clean run and on my last would have had a clean one but I refused to lift and nicked one of the finish line cones.

    It was a fast course. I liked it a lot better than last years course for this event. It was brutally hot, 95 degrees, but not humid and there was a strong breeze all day.

    I am a long way from being on top of the car.

    I should get the panasport wheels this week.

    t walgamuth
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    05 Jun 2011 07:23 AM
    I also found on a 90 degree day it is not easy to spin the tires on takeoff.
    t walgamuth
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    08 Jun 2011 09:38 PM

    Looks like the wheels will be in next week.

    Tom

    Clemens
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    09 Jun 2011 02:19 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    There was not a big turnout so we got six runs each. It was a course that had a FTD of 45.7 or so. It was mr. Lewis in the ground shaking CP camaro. I had second fastest raw time of 46.8 or so. The course was laid out crossing the asphalt strips at least six times. Some of them were a concern in the Cmod since they stuck up. I did not drag on them but they were very jarring.

    Tom,

    Dan and I went on Sunday. We had a few rain drops, but they did not affect grip, and it was a lot cooler.

    The asphalt strips don't bother my car. Your shocks may have too much high-speed compression. You want the low-speed damping, but need a knee in the curve so that you don't get excessive damping at high shock velocities. That keeps the fillings in your teeth when you go over bumps.

    Clemens

    Dick Rasmussen
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    09 Jun 2011 02:59 PM
    Clemens,

    What kind of shocks do you have?
    Do you think Koni 3011/3012 shocks would have the capabilities yours do?
    FYI my Koni 3011's were valved my Mark Ball of Koni to "work" at Forbes.

    Thanks!
    t walgamuth
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    09 Jun 2011 09:56 PM

    So how do you get a knee in the curve?

    I guess I might need to look for numbers on my shocks and see what I have. I understand they are Konis on the front and adjustable bilsteins on the back. As an observation I cannot compress the front but the back seems to have some compliance to it.

    t walgamuth
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    12 Jun 2011 07:49 AM
    I'm thinking about changing my restraints. The setup I have is impossible to tighten once you have it fastened and it is impossible to fasten without an assistant inside the car. Anybody know of a proper harness system that is easier to fasten and the driver can tighten the lap restraint as easily as the shoulder straps?
    t walgamuth
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    12 Jun 2011 07:52 AM
    Clemens, I am also wondering what your spring rates might be? My front end is very very stiff.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    12 Jun 2011 09:09 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    I'm thinking about changing my restraints. The setup I have is impossible to tighten once you have it fastened and it is impossible to fasten without an assistant inside the car. Anybody know of a proper harness system that is easier to fasten and the driver can tighten the lap restraint as easily as the shoulder straps?

    FYI,

    I responded to an email from Tom this morning with details of my solution that I'll be happy to share with anyone else.

    Jim at Race Car Supply sells a "formula car" version of RaceQuip pull up belts that work well in a narrow formula car.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    12 Jun 2011 11:06 AM
    I'm also looking for a replacement shifter lever and pivot on my REynard. Anybody know where I can buy one?
    Clemens
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    14 Jun 2011 12:29 PM
    DickR wrote:
    Clemens,

    What kind of shocks do you have?
    Do you think Koni 3011/3012 shocks would have the capabilities yours do?
    FYI my Koni 3011's were valved my Mark Ball of Koni to "work" at Forbes.

    Thanks!

    Dick,

    I installed Ohlins ST44 shocks two summers ago. However, my old, discontinued, leaky, decades-old SPAX shocks had the same general performance characteristics. If your shocks were valved for Forbes, I would think that the curve has a very distinct knee with very limited high-speed damping so that you would not go airborne over the bumps there. I would think that every name-brand shock can be valved this way.

    To answer Tom's questions, the knee is accomplished by according valving for low-speed and high-speed damping. Shocks have typically multiple features to control the damping, even if they are not adjustable. I run 500 lb/in and 600 lb/in springs. They results in wheel rates of a little above my corner weights (when ignoring the inches in the unit of measurment), if I remember correctly. Wheel rate equal to corner weights is a good rule of thumb to set spring rates. In order to do that, you will need the motion ratios of your suspension, with which you can calculate the required spring rates.

    Clemens

    t walgamuth
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    14 Jun 2011 10:09 PM
    A study of all that sounds like a good winter project. For the moment I don't think any of my shocks are leaking so I can afford to put it off.;)
    t walgamuth
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    15 Jun 2011 06:38 PM
    My other Nick co drive has become unavailable to co drive at Toledo. Any body know of any other potential co drives for that event?
    pru
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    16 Jun 2011 11:44 AM

    If you're thinking running this event, enter NOW (if you still can) and worry about a co-driver later. There are a few of us (RayT, CraigC, and I) running sans co-driver.

    Might be a moot point at this stage as the Toledo Tour entry at this time (~11:45 EST 6/16/11) is at 344 (of a max 350).

    t walgamuth
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    16 Jun 2011 06:09 PM
    So if one wants on the waiting list what does one do?
    jchiu
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    16 Jun 2011 06:53 PM
    There are already 351 entries for the Toledo tour.
    Clemens
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    16 Jun 2011 07:19 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    So if one wants on the waiting list what does one do?

    Tom,

    If online registration does not work anymore, fill out the paper entry form you get from the Toledo NT page and fax it in.

    Clemens

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    16 Jun 2011 11:44 PM
    jchiu wrote:
    There are already 351 entries for the Toledo tour.

     


    One guy is listed twice. I was thinking about going and thinking about asking for a codrive in a CM, but looks like time ran out. I'll probably do the St. Louis Evo phase I on the same day.
    t walgamuth
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    20 Jun 2011 06:11 AM

    On saturday I took the little Reynard to Indy to get one of Mark's alignments. Whilst getting the car set up to do that he discovered that the lr suspension was binding and when loaded effectively became a solidly mounted device. When this happened all the suspension action in the rear came from the right side and the only way to load that was through making the entire car tilt against the right side suspension.

    Not good.

    So after an hour or so of us both looking around that area we found that the spring , as it tilted when the suspension compressed it and was fouling on the clutch bell crank arm and base. It was unclear that this was actually causing the problem but Mark decided the thing to do was definitly eleminate it from the equation. We were able to do this by swapping out the rear springs with a short set which we borrowed from Mr. B.

    Then we set the rake on the car. To begin with it had an inch and a half in front clearance and two and a quarter in the rear. I requested an inch and a half all around, reasoning that it would give a bit more rear grip.

    On saturday I also managed to break the Heim joint on my front sway bar linkage so we arrived in Conersville with both sways unhooked. I discovered through conversations that they are fairly available at places like Ace hardware so Jimmy got on the internet with his phone and found an ACe like place, Gillmans, in town where we called and found they have heim joints. After finding out that we were working second running third I drove in and picked up the heim joints, so Jimmy and I installed the one in question and reconnected the sway bars.

    Jimmy ran first and found massive understeer, loads of grip on the rear and none in front. So we dialed in more rear sway until we got it somewhat neutral. As our runs progressed the track continued to dry.

    I had been having an inixplicable problem on launch where I was fouling my right foot on the brake pedal and taking an eternity to shift from first to second so on my third run I decided to skip the shift by taking off in second. It worked and I managed a cone free run on my third. I actually managed to get some fairly aggressive sections in on this run and did not realize it until later but had at that point second quick time of the day in C mod.

    Nick knew it though and pulled out his best run on his fourth beating me by a tenth or two.

    I then went out and knowing I had one clean run in for a decent time really reached a little on my last run. On the far end of the course was that tricky decreasing radius corner that Jimmy and I had trouble with all day. On this run was no exception and I made a rather large tank slapper down there and managed to make it through somehow without hitting any cones. At that point I figured the run was toast but went ahead and played it out getting the second crossover and the run to the finish line pretty well.

    When he handed me the slip it was better than my previous run, amazingly, and I got beat by Nick but just .06 seconds.

    I could not have felt any better if I had won class.

    So it appears that my poor beaten and worn Reynard has a lot of potential. It is amazing how much better it is with both sides of the rear suspension working. Neither Jimmy or I spun out on sunday for the first time.

    Plenty to do on it as there are lots of little flaws and interferences we can work through to get it working better.

    But we owe it all to the hugely skilled and always generous Mark.

    Thanks Mark!

    Locked
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    20 Jun 2011 10:29 AM
    Great description of the day... I'll be sure to relay to Mark since he never get on a computer.
    The Nebulizer
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    20 Jun 2011 11:31 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Then we set the rake on the car. To begin with it had an inch and a half in front clearance and two and a quarter in the rear. I requested an inch and a half all around, reasoning that it would give a bit more rear grip.

    Jimmy ran first and found massive understeer, loads of grip on the rear and none in front. So we dialed in more rear sway until we got it somewhat neutral. As our runs progressed the track continued to dry.


    Are you going to try to raise the rear a little?

    GChambers
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    20 Jun 2011 12:00 PM
    Tom, good to hear you're making progress with the car! You need to get that thing out to Nationals!
    Dick Rasmussen
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    20 Jun 2011 12:14 PM
    Tom,

    After almost 20 years in CM I'm still amazed at how many different cars, suspension setups, gearing, and driving styles can be quick. Making sure the basics are healthy is setup requirement number 1. Sticky tires are key also. The rest (assuming the engine runs like they usually do) is down to fine tuning and driver.

    Dick (going to my first autox since last Fall next Sunday with a new engine, new suspension bearings, etc, new data logger and video system, and a variety of new little stuff. Hopefully I'll remember how to drive.)
    Dick Rasmussen
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    20 Jun 2011 12:17 PM
    DickR wrote:
    Slightly tail happy beats push in my book (grin).

    What you might do, especially if adding 50 lbs of ballast makes the car tail happy for Jimmy, is make sure the rear suspension isn't bottoming or binding in some part of its travel. Rod ends, spherical bearings, etc. don't last forever.

    Dick

    Tom,

    You may recall I mentioned suspension binding in early May. <GRIN> :-)

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    20 Jun 2011 06:34 PM
    Sorry, it just went right over my head. Mark did not miss it though!
    t walgamuth
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    20 Jun 2011 06:34 PM
    Oh my no! We'll look for ways to get more grip in front!
    t walgamuth
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    20 Jun 2011 06:36 PM
    GChambers wrote:
    Tom, good to hear you're making progress with the car! You need to get that thing out to Nationals!

    Thanks G! Now I just have to figure out a tour event I can do and line up a co driver.

    Locked
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    20 Jun 2011 09:20 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Oh my no! We'll look for ways to get more grip in front!

    Tom, get jimmy to help you measure the motion ratio.. Both front and rear.. I'll help you get in the ball park with spring rates so both ends are working.

    Also, doing the divisional championship event at Grissom will qualify you for Nationals. Is Jimmy planning on running that event? Want me to look for a co-driver? Maybe something for both that event and Nationals?

    jchiu
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    20 Jun 2011 09:25 PM
    Locked wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Oh my no! We'll look for ways to get more grip in front!

    Tom, get jimmy to help you measure the motion ratio.. Both front and rear.. I'll help you get in the ball park with spring rates so both ends are working.

    Also, doing the divisional championship event at Grissom will qualify you for Nationals. Is Jimmy planning on running that event? Want me to look for a co-driver? Maybe something for both that event and Nationals?

    I'll be measuring the motion ratios later this week. Will keep in touch with you once I've got it measured.

    I am not planning on running any events outside of Indy region events as my budget is stretched pretty thin as-is. May run a couple of non-Indy events in my car just to keep my MSMD membership active. I know that Tom would be interested in a co-driver in the div and nationals.

    I never got to run the car in the complete dry due to our staggered run order, but I think both Tom and I agree that more front grip would really help a lot right now. If either you or Mark would be willing, I'd like to throw our GPS data logger on your cars for a run sometime just to have some comparative data. Just velcro to hold down the GPS receiver (like your MaxQ) and keep the Moto Q9 in your pockets.

    Locked
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    20 Jun 2011 09:41 PM
    I'd be happy to let you record a run...
    t walgamuth
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    20 Jun 2011 10:36 PM
    Yes a co drive at divisionals would be fine. The fellow in Bloomington might do it. Or the other nick. but in the absence of any firm interest on their part I am interested in an alternative if you have one. I actually think the Reynard uses the same suspension arms front and rear so probably the ratios are the same as well.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    20 Jun 2011 11:05 PM
    Tom,

    FYI. Found it Googling motion ratios (didn't find them).

    http://www.gnegy.com/reynard/tech.php

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    21 Jun 2011 05:52 AM
    Thanks Dick!
    t walgamuth
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    26 Jun 2011 07:00 AM
    I'm gonna head up to Portage HS today and run with the INR.
    t walgamuth
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    26 Jun 2011 09:26 PM

    We ran at portage high school. The course was a combination of mostly very tight corners which a c mod could barely make and one very fast slalom which i treated like Steve Brinkterhoff (sorry if I spelled it wrong steve!) ....a straightaway! At the end of that was a turn to the right which I had a horrible push on and then a carosel which was pretty slow as well. This was followed by two ninteys with guard cones restricting the outside line, each of these ninteys were more than nintey. I asked them to make them less tight after the walk through and they did (thanks INR!) but they were still very very tight.

    So I got in one or two cone free runs out of EIGHT! I am pretty sure I set fast time raw but was seventh on PAX. The fellow with the E mod fiero from South Bend who has won nationals multiple times was there and I beat him on raw time so that felt pretty good..

    The INR is definately one of my favorite groups of folks to run with. Very friendly and fun to be around!

    As I unloaded the trailer from the truck at home I wiggled the right rear and found the wheel that Mark noticed making nasty noises is a little loose so I suppose that means a wheel bearing rather than CV joint.

    Other than that repair the search is for mechanical front grip.

    Also Jimmy says he will be moving to CA after our July event and so I am looking for a co driver for any events after that.

    It was a lovely day up there. A little warm but a great breeze most of the day.

    nutty944
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    26 Jun 2011 11:03 PM
    glad to hear it was fun, Tom. If you decide to go up there again, let me know and maybe we'll convoy up that way with you.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    27 Jun 2011 07:56 AM

    Autocrossed my car for the first time since last October yesterday. The fresh engine and all the other "refresh after 20 years" stuff worked perfectly. Driver was, of course, way behind the car due to lack of seat time. Wish I could be at Toledo . . .

    Dick

    CM85

    Locked
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    27 Jun 2011 10:50 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Other than that repair the search is for mechanical front grip.

    Have you been able to take a motion ratio measurement?

    jchiu
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    27 Jun 2011 11:20 AM
    Locked wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Other than that repair the search is for mechanical front grip.

    Have you been able to take a motion ratio measurement?

    I will be heading over tonight to help Tom do the measurement. Will talk to you once we get the numbers in to discuss the direction to proceed on spring rates.

    Also, in case the point was lost in Tom's post: There is a 90% chance I will be moving away to greener pastures in August, so Tom is actively seeking a co-driver for his Reynard after the next points event. The car is still a work in progress but the times from the last event show that it is progressing in the right direction. For those on the fence about driving a CM, I quote Mr. Ferris Bueller: "If you have the means, I highly recommend picking one up." Or in this case, talk to Tom ASAP.

    t walgamuth
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    27 Jun 2011 08:10 PM

    After 8 runs yesterday I still have a slight case of rubberneck!

    We calculated the front motion ratio to be .28, rear is .354.

    And we found a loose axle bolt on the rr. A very large allen is required to tighten it. I will have to go buy one.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Jun 2011 07:39 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    After 8 runs yesterday I still have a slight case of rubberneck!

    We calculated the front motion ratio to be .28, rear is .354.

    And we found a loose axle bolt on the rr. A very large allen is required to tighten it. I will have to go buy one.

    Tom,

    Please clarify the motion ratios. Are you saying that moving the spindles 1 inch compresses the spring 0.28 inch front and 0.354 inch rear? That doesn't "sound right". Also did you measure from approximately ride height?

    Dick

    jchiu
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    28 Jun 2011 08:24 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    After 8 runs yesterday I still have a slight case of rubberneck!

    We calculated the front motion ratio to be .28, rear is .354.

    And we found a loose axle bolt on the rr. A very large allen is required to tighten it. I will have to go buy one.

    I looked at the numbers I wrote down for the front again, it works out to be 0.333 in the front, not 0.280 as I originally told you. Makes more sense that the front and rear MRs are closer as you noted that the A-arms are the same.

    For clarification for Dick: It was 7/8" deflection of the shock for 21/8" deflection of the wheel. Numbers seem a bit odd to me too as I am used to dealing with MRs of road cars in the 0.6-1.0 range, but I had no basis to go by for these pushrod suspension setups.

    I think I agree that the numbers don't seem right. Thinking about it that would mean to get the wheel rate of ~300 in the rear we need a 2400#/in spring. (wheel rate = spring rate * MR^2 if I recall correctly). Maybe part of that has to do with the suspension binding issue in the rear, but I suspect something else. Will call you to explain tonight.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Jun 2011 09:40 AM
    You have almost 3 inches of wheel travel in this measurement. Was the movement "centered" at normal ride height? That is roughly 21/16" travel in droop and 21/16" in bump. The "concern" is that if you measured from "full droop" for example there may be a bunch of non-linear motion ratio at first.

    FYI a more modern formula car would have motion ratios close to 1 in order to get maximum travel from the shocks. My understanding is that pushrod suspensions actually make this easier than with rocker arms.

    My 85 VD has motion ratios of roughly .58 f and .92 rear (.34 squared and .84 squared). It is rockers. I know that Gary Godula's Reynard had motion ratios that needed pretty stiff springs but I think his was rockers. However they weren't in the 2400 lb range I don't think.
    Locked
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    28 Jun 2011 09:47 AM
    yikes! If I moved my tire up 2.6" my frame would be on the ground.
    jchiu
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    28 Jun 2011 09:48 AM
    DickR wrote:
    You have almost 3 inches of wheel travel in this measurement. Was the movement "centered" at normal ride height? That is roughly 21/16" travel in droop and 21/16" in bump. The "concern" is that if you measured from "full droop" for example there may be a bunch of non-linear motion ratio at first.

    FYI a more modern formula car would have motion ratios close to 1 in order to get maximum travel from the shocks. My understanding is that pushrod suspensions actually make this easier than with rocker arms.

    My 85 VD has motion ratios of roughly .38 f and .92 rear (.34 squared and .84 squared). It is rockers. I know that Gary Godula's Reynard had motion ratios that needed pretty stiff springs but I think his was rockers. However they weren't in the 2400 lb range I don't think.

    This was what I was alluding to for the message to Tom. I think what we did was try to get a linear approximation of the MR in the nonlinear range.

    What method would you suggest to measure the MR accurately? If we take one measurement with the car on the ground and then another with the car on blocks, we need to weigh down the car to the same initial ride height in order to get the springs to compress and get the 'bump' measurement. That sound about right?

    Locked
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    28 Jun 2011 09:53 AM
    Measure front and rear ride height,
    Measure the center of the wheel to the ground, or just measure the radius of your wheel.
    Take the wheels off the car..
    Set the car on blocks at ride height.
    Set the suspension on a block putting the center of the hub at the same height as with the wheel.
    Take a measurement of the shock, move the hub up 1", take another measurement.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Jun 2011 10:38 AM
    Unless you have a way to safely (for you and for the car) secure the chassis and compress the suspension you will probably need to remove the springs and, of course, anti-roll bars.

    Note that my initial post as quoted by Jimmy has a typo. The front motion ratio on my car is about .58 with the ratio squared of .34

    As you do this it would be "good" to take interim measurements to see if the motion ratio is "rising rate", "linear", or "falling rate". My understanding is that you need to avoid "falling rate" in bump.

    With pushrods you may have some options regarding spring perch locations, pushrod length, etc. The setup notes I linked previously MAY include some info on where they should be.

    Dick
    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Jun 2011 10:42 AM
    FYI this same basic technique is used for checking bump steer (toe change with ride height). With a modern (including mid 80's FF's) formula car "0" bump steer is practical.

    jchiu
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    28 Jun 2011 10:59 AM
    Locked wrote:
    Measure front and rear ride height,
    Measure the center of the wheel to the ground, or just measure the radius of your wheel.
    Take the wheels off the car..
    Set the car on blocks at ride height.
    Set the suspension on a block putting the center of the hub at the same height as with the wheel.
    Take a measurement of the shock, move the hub up 1", take another measurement.

    My thinking is that moving the hub up 1" (assuming the prior state already has the spring loaded at its nominal deflection) will just lift that side of the car up 1" and not introduce additional spring compression. I think the springs and possibly the ARBs have to be removed/disconnected to get this to work.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Jun 2011 11:27 AM
    See my post above . . . . You are correct in both regards.
    barryott
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    28 Jun 2011 07:46 PM
    DickR wrote:
    It is rockers. I know that Gary Godula's Reynard had motion ratios that needed pretty stiff springs but I think his was rockers. However they weren't in the 2400 lb range I don't think.

    Hey guys, maybe I can contribute a little.... Dick, you mentioned Gary's '88 Reynard, so I thought I'd chime in with my setup, maybe it will help?? Below is a link to a post on my local region's site with my car's setup. Please note that the MRs I posted are upside down, I *always* seem to get it backwards. You'll see my springs weren't particulary stiff. Also note that the MRs are based on simple length measurements, they seemed close enough to me to start tuning....

    For me, it was really helpful to talk to Joe Stimola (RIP), he *really, really* got me started down the right path! He told me what springs to start with, how to tune the suspension, and when to call him back :-) I know his son is running the business now, and I bet he's got tons of knowledge and a lifetime of notes.....

    http://rmsolo.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1890

    Best of luck!

    Barry Ott

    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Jun 2011 07:59 PM
    Barry,

    You don't have it "upside down" since the two "presentations" are both common. The end result is that if the wheel moves further than the spring/shock perch the wheel rate will be lower than the spring rate. Most FF's used for autocrossing probably have more wheel movement than spring/shock movement so that is a good "sanity check" for anyone trying to make sure they understand the numbers for their car.

    Dick
    barryott
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    28 Jun 2011 08:08 PM

    Thanks for the clarification Dick! I figured if I explained how I arrived at my numbers, then the who ever was reading it could get the info they wanted. Dude, you should write a book, you know soooo much!!!

    Barry

    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Jun 2011 10:56 PM
    barryott wrote:

    Thanks for the clarification Dick! I figured if I explained how I arrived at my numbers, then the who ever was reading it could get the info they wanted. Dude, you should write a book, you know soooo much!!!

    Barry

    The books exist. I just happen to have read MANY in the last "few" decades.One of the many nice things about CM is that guys like yourself and Peter Calhoun who have won in the class and guys like me who have "been around" for a long time plus a whole range of other guys are willing to share info to help "new guys". What is also nice is that so many different cars and so many different setups can work in the right hands.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    01 Jul 2011 09:34 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    After 8 runs yesterday I still have a slight case of rubberneck!

    We calculated the front motion ratio to be .28, rear is .354.

    And we found a loose axle bolt on the rr. A very large allen is required to tighten it. I will have to go buy one.

    I tightened and locktited the big bolt.

    I checked the final times from Portage. I was third fastest raw time. First was a shifter Kart. second was that E mod former national champion winning car being driven by the former national champion's brother. Seventh fastest on pax. I imagine I left a second on the track with the push. They ran me in the X class where I got second to the shifter kart.

    Fun stuff!

    t walgamuth
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    04 Jul 2011 09:45 AM
    Can someone tell me who to contact about the club points scoring? They have me down twice with my name misspelled once so my points are divided, making my standing worse than it even is.;)
    GChambers
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    04 Jul 2011 07:18 PM
    I think Velma is the person to talk to. I wouldn't worry about sending her an email or message. Just let her know at the next event and I'm sure she'll make sure it gets fixed.
    t walgamuth
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    04 Jul 2011 10:47 PM
    Thanks G!
    t walgamuth
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    17 Jul 2011 10:26 PM

    I went to the driving school yesterday and the event today. A great course, Larry! I never got the entry to the big slalom with any confidence. With the way it was set up I never could read it accurately. Fortunately with the dozen plus runs on saturdary and today I was able to get it fairly well just by force of habit.

    I had a minor drama with my helmet bag falling off my wagon on the way to grid. I drove today in a loaner helmet and with a rag taped to my right foot after trying my first run with my huge street shoes and having a dnf at the big slalom entry when my gas foot got stuck under the brake pedal!;) Luckily we found the bag next to Jack Tovey's motor home!

    Running the Hancooks on saturday was an adventure. With the new wheels not fitting I was lucky to have brought the hancooks along. The Hoosiers today resulted in a best time of 43.185. Yesterday on the cooks my best time was 45.007. Both runs were fairly cleanly run.

    I'm not sure of my placing today but the best it could have been was fourth I imagine. As usual the c mod class was loaded with experienced drivers. Mark led the way with Nick second and Don (Mark's nemisis) finishing a very close third to Nick. Five cars, eight drivers today!

    i guessed close on the changes needed in setup from yesterday with the slippery hancooks to the lovely hoosiers today. We did adjust the rear bar a bit and fiddled with air pressure a bit.

    The car seems pretty decent now and my car placement was fairly good today. I just gotta get better at how much to brake going into the turns and when to start braking.

    No spins for myself or Jimmy.

    a great day!

    Locked
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    17 Jul 2011 10:36 PM

    That 43.1 was right down there with Ray... Good for either 4th or 5th depending on the hundreth, bumping Kevin back to 6th with his 43.7, unless Jimmy was below that.

    Top 6 drivers 1.5 seconds apart in 5 different cars... How much more fun can you have?!

    Adam303
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    18 Jul 2011 09:55 AM
    Great job to all you Indy C-Mod guys yesterday. You all drove great and put some nice times up on the board.
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    18 Jul 2011 11:31 AM

    Coned away a 43.6 on the 3rd run, even with opposite lock through the entire south end sweeper and tons of throttle to prevent a spin. Car didn't feel as good on the final run and I overdrove it a bit. It's been fun running with you guys this year, best of luck to all of the Indy "Mod" Squad!

    nutty944
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    18 Jul 2011 06:14 PM
    Been great running with you, Jimmy!!! Best of luck in CA. If you ever find yourself out here the same time we're running, you're welcome to a seat in the 944!
    jchiu
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    18 Jul 2011 07:37 PM
    nutty944 wrote:
    Been great running with you, Jimmy!!! Best of luck in CA. If you ever find yourself out here the same time we're running, you're welcome to a seat in the 944!

    I'll be at Peoples brew co at some point Saturday afternoon, will give you a call to see if you're game for a beer. I'll be back in December and will still organize the non-official annual kart race if people are still interested. I'll make a separate thread about it later on.

    t walgamuth
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    20 Jul 2011 06:26 PM

    So it turns out I beat Ray by .002 for fourth place. So with Nick beating Don by what was it, .006? Heh! Good clean fun. I calculated out what .002 sec is in horizontal distance....2.12"!

    So I beat Ray by two inches and Nick beat Don by six or so!

    GChambers
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    20 Jul 2011 06:31 PM
    You were also about 9th on the PAX. Good work.
    t walgamuth
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    20 Jul 2011 09:44 PM

    Thanks....actually it was seventh pax, sixth raw.

    This C mod stuff is fun.!

    G, we are missing you!

    GChambers
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    21 Jul 2011 11:22 AM
    I wish I wouldn't have missed this last event but I had a date with a raft that was floating on a lake for a few days. :-) Ben and I will be at Divisionals.
    t walgamuth
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    21 Jul 2011 08:07 PM
    By the way I hear Larry Harts has bought a C Mod car. I think it is a reynard. Either an 84 or 86, one year different than mine IIRC. We are a veritable hot bed of C Mod action!
    Locked
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    21 Jul 2011 09:18 PM
    I'm going to regret promoting the class so much when all you hot shoes start beat me.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    22 Jul 2011 07:53 AM
    Locked wrote:
    I'm going to regret promoting the class so much when all you hot shoes start beat me.

    When I showed up in C Mod at the 93 Nationals there were a total of 5 or 6 current or former National Champions in other classes running C Mod (I was a "former" and have been since 86). THAT is competition. I managed to trophy. I seriously doubt I will be able to trophy the next time I show up at Nats.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    26 Jul 2011 06:16 AM
    Jason and I are planning to do the divisionals for sure and are considering seriously going to nationals. I've got to talk to my boss about getting the time off for nationals. We are pretty busy at the moment. I've got a few things to do to the car before divisionals. We are also contemplating the value of the new tires for nationals.
    t walgamuth
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    26 Jul 2011 06:19 AM
    DickR wrote:
    Locked wrote:
    I'm going to regret promoting the class so much when all you hot shoes start beat me.

    When I showed up in C Mod at the 93 Nationals there were a total of 5 or 6 current or former National Champions in other classes running C Mod (I was a "former" and have been since 86). THAT is competition. I managed to trophy. I seriously doubt I will be able to trophy the next time I show up at Nats.

    Dick

    I came to C mod because the rules have not changed for thirty years. Only problem is now I am competing with folks who have been running FF for over twenty years! A classic example of the double edged sword!

    Locked
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    26 Jul 2011 09:44 AM
    You guys need to decide quickly. Early registration closes in 3 days...

    The good news about buying new tires for Nationals is you can wrap them and then use them for the Blytheville tour the 1st of October, and/or the Nashville tour at the end of October.

    Then wrap them and store them indoors over the winter and you'll have decent rubber for locals at the beginning of next year. Run the local events post divisionals with the tires you have now.
    t walgamuth
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    26 Jul 2011 10:15 AM
    Sounds like a plan.
    t walgamuth
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    26 Jul 2011 10:14 PM

    I got the time off cleared today with my Boss and the lovely Mrs. W. Nationals here we come!

    The Nebulizer
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    27 Jul 2011 01:26 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I got the time off cleared today with my Boss and the lovely Mrs. W.  Nationals here we come!

     

     

     


    Still have to clear it with Mrs. P...
    GChambers
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    27 Jul 2011 01:12 PM
    That's great to hear. Have fun at Nationals.
    t walgamuth
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    29 Jul 2011 06:15 PM
    i'm thinking of going down to Louisville tomorrow to run. I'd have to be rolling by 6 am.
    boardkat
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    29 Jul 2011 06:24 PM
    PNW CM tire warmer checking in (andy howe's '82 reynard). saw that we made it to 16 for lincoln, awesome! even more amazing is that 11 of ya are from IN/MI/OH/IL - you guys rock for rallying the troops!! we don't quite have those numbers out here yet, but we're working on generating more interest in the class. see everybody next month!
    t walgamuth
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    29 Jul 2011 08:06 PM

    Thanks!

    We have quite the hotbed of C mod action! I looked at the results in Loiusville and found at least three c mods there.

    I decided to stay home, though.

    GChambers
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    29 Jul 2011 09:38 PM
    I've registered but I'm doubtful for Nationals. I'm giving myself a week to think about it. Unfortunately it looks like life is getting in the way of me going.
    t walgamuth
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    29 Jul 2011 10:37 PM
    We've missed you G!
    GChambers
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    31 Jul 2011 10:54 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    We've missed you G!

    Awwww Tom, that's sweet. Thanks. Heh....

    Life is just getting in the way of this season. Losing Ben didn't help either. Gus is driving with me at the Indy Region event after Nationals and should be back full time by the end of June next season. We'll be back at it soon enough.

    t walgamuth
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    31 Jul 2011 04:39 PM
    sounds good!
    t walgamuth
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    05 Aug 2011 09:04 PM

    Broke my hub this morning at the test and tune. The parts are not available locally so I was advised by Steve Brinkterhoff to take it to Mike LeVeque (I am sure that is not the correct spelling on Steve's name). Mike mended my hub back together, It was in at least five pieces, heli -arcing it all , then milled it smooth on the business side. Then he brazed my brake drum back together. We also installed 3 new lug studs. Should be ready to rock and roll in the morning. It looks like a classic Larry course.

    Speaking of Larry, he was there with his new '83 Reynard FF. I am very jealous of it. It is very clean and has all body panels in place and those lovely drilled rotors.

    See you all tomorrow!

    Today was one of those up- and down days...down when the wheel fell off and really up when Michael finished the repairs.

    Just got home. I will be up early so I can get to the course at 7 am.

    t walgamuth
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    07 Aug 2011 07:46 PM

    So yesterday Jason and I made four runs each. The car seemed to be handling fine but we did not master the course. On my last run I managed to apply the brakes and gas at the same time and dnf my way through a cone wall. Later we both decided that the brakes were locking the fronts and the rears did not seem to be doing anything. So this morning I adjusted the gas pedal back down so it is no longer even with the brake pedal and Mark helped us to hopefully balance the brake bias.

    Jason got in two runs but on my second we could not get the car to start. The starter has always been noisy but it always started so I have been putting off doing anything with it. Bad move. so I got in only one slow run.

    Jason got a run in Geoff's car so he got three runs in total.

    Tomorrow I will take the starter to a local shop which I have had good luck with in the past rebuilding odd ball stuff and see if they can fix it.

    Locked
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    07 Aug 2011 09:08 PM
    I'm sorry you had trouble today Tom. :(
    t walgamuth
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    07 Aug 2011 10:29 PM
    Thanks Nick!
    nutty944
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    08 Aug 2011 07:30 AM
    Sorry to hear of the starter. Guessing B&M electrical? They are really good over there. Got a few things working for me I had almost given up on.
    t walgamuth
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    09 Aug 2011 05:43 AM
    Yes.
    t walgamuth
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    14 Aug 2011 10:28 PM
    The starter is not fixed yet. I have to call tomorrow. I plan to pull off the lr wheel hub and get it magnafluxed. Perhaps the front too.
    t walgamuth
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    15 Aug 2011 07:52 PM
    The adapter to mate the datsun starter to the reynard bell housing is cracked extensively. (is there any other way with a race car?) Now I am trying to reach Mike LeVeque to see about welding it.;)
    t walgamuth
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    19 Aug 2011 12:03 AM
    Mike welded it for me. I will get it back on the car tomorrow. Jason and I are planning to go on up to Toledo on Sunday to run on the concrete to get ready for Nationals.
    Locked
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    19 Aug 2011 09:39 AM
    My starter bracket was cracked as well... It was the 1st piece of the car I changed.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 Aug 2011 12:30 PM
    Locked wrote:
    My starter bracket was cracked as well... It was the 1st piece of the car I changed.

    Nick,

    Where did you get the "fancy" replacement bracket and do you think it is applicable to other cars besides ours and the car it was designed for (Swift?) ? I don't need one (custom bracket in 1992 is still perfect) but someone else might.

    Thanks,

    Dick

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    19 Aug 2011 01:10 PM
    DickR wrote:

    Nick,

    Where did you get the "fancy" replacement bracket and do you think it is applicable to other cars besides ours and the car it was designed for (Swift?) ? I don't need one (custom bracket in 1992 is still perfect) but someone else might.

    Thanks,

    Dick

    I bought the billet piece made by Fast Forward. The VD casting is different than the Swift. We had to make a longer shaft from the starter to the flywheel. I doubt this could be used on anything other than a swift or vd.


    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 Aug 2011 01:48 PM

    Nick,

    Thanks! My custom bracket isn't as elegant as yours and is mounted a little further rearward than I recall your pic showing. Mine also needed a slightly shorter longer shaft than yours.

    The "advice" to CM FF guys is to check the starter and the brackets ASAP and plan for the possible need to get something custom. The Off the shelf "Tilton's" may or not work. However, like so many other things about a FF used for autox, this kind of stuff is a "one time" expense. I'm still safely using almost everything in the car that I upgraded in 1992. I went to enough events that the open trailer has over 80K miles!

    Dick


    Locked
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    19 Aug 2011 02:44 PM
    I replaced both that bracket, and my starter early on.. We had to tap my original starter at the 1st event this year with a hammer to get it to crank. That was enough for me to say it's time for a new one. I'm not willing to lose an event because the car won't start.

    It's also why I use a jump battery even though the on board battery is likely plenty good enough to get thru a weekend.
    GChambers
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    21 Aug 2011 08:41 PM
    I just replaced the starter on my car a few weeks ago. Joe Fisher had converted it to use a 79 Toyota Corolla starter. $89 at O'Reilly's Autoparts and Forumula Ford Parts Supply Emporium. I still have the old one and will have it rebuilt as a spare that I'll probably never use. Hopefully...
    t walgamuth
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    21 Aug 2011 10:18 PM

    After working the Subaru event I went home and finished up the starter installation. It is acting exactly the same as before all the work, so I will be seeking some assistance in diagnosing the problem asap.

    Jason and I went up to Toledo and ran there in his M3. That is a very nice car! It was quite an adjustment from the FF though! The only fly in the ointment was I never seemed able to get the semiautomatic transmisson (sorry Jason I probably insulted your car by calling it that) to give me the gear I wanted at the right time, consistantly, every time.

    The facility and running of the event was first rate and most enjoyable! A fellow brought in a log cabin on wheels which served barbeque and other similar stuff. Great food!

    It was a long day though as I got up at 3:40 am to make it to Ft Wayne to meet Jason at 630 am.

    The planned trip to nationals is now in limbo with the latest failures of my FF though. We are regrouping and trying to figure out what to do.

    G'night!

    nutty944
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    21 Aug 2011 11:02 PM
    If you need/want a hand at all this week, I have off work, be glad to offer any help I can give.
    t walgamuth
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    22 Aug 2011 05:51 AM

    Thanks Chris, my email is twalgamuth@comcast.net. We can talk about that.

    Tom

    barryott
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    22 Aug 2011 08:33 AM

    Hey Tom, Marc Bushman is an absolute wizard with our starters. Do a search on Apexspeed for his name, you'll see tons of praise! I had a couple starters die, I took them to a local shop, they "fixed" them, they both worked for one event and then died again. After Marc fixed one, it was never a problem again. He can be reached at 630-279-8834 or marc871 at msn.com

    Good luck!

    Barry Ott

    t walgamuth
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    22 Aug 2011 06:34 PM
    Thanks Barry!
    t walgamuth
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    22 Aug 2011 07:28 PM

    I just pulled the starter again and found the new gear all chewed up. Also I found the ring gear chewed up as well and found that the starter is only engaging about a third of the teeths face on the ring gear. It looks like a new ring gear, a new drive gear and a way of making the drive gear engage more of the ring gear on start up.

    Now I have to look at what must come off to get to the flywheel. I cannot tell if the adaptor must come off to get at the flywheel or not. It looks at first glance that I must separate it at the back of the block. The entire rear suspension looks to be attached to the adapter, and transaxle.

    Is that the drill? Pull the entire rear end with the rear suspension attached?

    Its a Yikes but does not really look too bad. Awkward perhaps.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    22 Aug 2011 10:34 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I just pulled the starter again and found the new gear all chewed up. Also I found the ring gear chewed up as well and found that the starter is only engaging about a third of the teeths face on the ring gear. It looks like a new ring gear, a new drive gear and a way of making the drive gear engage more of the ring gear on start up.

    Now I have to look at what must come off to get to the flywheel. I cannot tell if the adaptor must come off to get at the flywheel or not. It looks at first glance that I must separate it at the back of the block. The entire rear suspension looks to be attached to the adapter, and transaxle.

    Is that the drill? Pull the entire rear end with the rear suspension attached?

    Its a Yikes but does not really look too bad. Awkward perhaps.

    Bummer.

    If you are "relatively lucky" the whole rear half of the car (transaxle with adapter and suspension) will "split" from the frame and engine with the suspension attached. Consider supporting the car/engine low enough to the floor that you can use something like a furniture dolly under the transaxle to literally roll the rear assembly awway from the engine/frame.

    The flywheel probably won't be "keyed" to a specific position on the crank so you will need to mark it in order to keep the timing marks correct when you reassemble.

    Dick


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    23 Aug 2011 06:12 AM

    It does not really sound too bad on time to do. Can you give an estimate of how many hours to r and r it all?

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    23 Aug 2011 07:54 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    It does not really sound too bad on time to do. Can you give an estimate of how many hours to r and r it all?

    Tom,

    I would say for one person on a "learning curve" a full day . . . plus however much time it takes to get a shop to change the ring gear.

    This assumes that you have done this basic kind of work previously (clutch/flywheel/brake bleeding, etc.). Also assumes your car "comes apart" easily without damage and that the suspension settings are not moved. Don't forget that you need some sort of pilot tool to align the clutch so the trans input shaft can go back in.

    The big issue may be getting the right ring gear and pinion gear combination figured out.

    Dick

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    23 Aug 2011 09:33 AM
    DickR wrote:
    t walgamuth wrote:

    It does not really sound too bad on time to do. Can you give an estimate of how many hours to r and r it all?

    Tom,

    I would say for one person on a "learning curve" a full day . . . plus however much time it takes to get a shop to change the ring gear.

    This assumes that you have done this basic kind of work previously (clutch/flywheel/brake bleeding, etc.). Also assumes your car "comes apart" easily without damage and that the suspension settings are not moved. Don't forget that you need some sort of pilot tool to align the clutch so the trans input shaft can go back in.

    The big issue may be getting the right ring gear and pinion gear combination figured out.

    Dick

    You lost me with the last statement about the ring and pinion. If I understand correctly that should not be touched, right?

    Tom

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    23 Aug 2011 10:33 AM
    Tom,

    Sorry about the confusion. When I said "pinion" I meant the starter drive gear (aka "pinion") that is chewed up. The "ring" is the flywheel ring gear. Isn't terminology fun :-) ?

    If you search "Bushman" on Apexspeed you should find threads which discuss this in detail . . . or just call Marc or Keith.
    t walgamuth
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    23 Aug 2011 01:15 PM
    No worries! After thinking about it I decided that was what you meant. I guess i will just go out and start pulling it apart tonight. There really is no option.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    23 Aug 2011 01:25 PM
    Tom,

    I recommend that you pay close attention to the location of all washers or anything else that may be serving as a "shim" or a "spacer". Also, there is a chance there are "hidden" long bolts/studs that go through the adapter, etc. to the rear of the engine block. Don't forget to mark the flywheel to crank position.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    23 Aug 2011 02:32 PM
    Thansk Dick! I am duly warned.
    t walgamuth
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    24 Aug 2011 06:03 AM

    Summary:

    So I had the starter rebuilt and the adapter welded and put it all back in the car. After about a dozen tries to start the engine the starter was back to grinding and making horrible noises just like before.



    So I pulled the starter and found the gear all chewed up. I also measured the distance from the nose gear of the starter to the ring gear and found that the starter was only able to engage about a third of the face of the ring gear, so something is needed there.



    And the ring gear will need to be replaced so my next project is to pull the rear end off the car to replace the ring gear. So I will at least do the pilot bearing and the throw out bearing too.



    Is there a recommended clutch and pp setup? Of course I will want very light and very cheap and very strong. Heh heh!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    24 Aug 2011 07:50 AM

    Tom,

    Since I'm "first" responding:

    First, are you still going to Nationals this year? If so, you may not have time to do more than make sure the current clutch isn't "fried" since changing more than bolting in a fresh version of what is already hiding in there is a "project".

    Cheap and strong is a stock type clutch. If you have one already just make sure it is healthy/fresh using all the normal "clutch health" criteria.

    Light would be a "racing style" such as the 7.25 Tilton. I got mine from http://www.taylor-race.com/subcat2....c%20Tilton many years ago. Replaced the clutch disk once just to be sure it was OK. It was barely worn and didn't need replacement.

    If you currently have a stock type clutch, converting to a Tilton, etc. normally requires flywheel machining afaik. Plus you need to "baby" the clutch in regard to slipping it to drive on to a trailer, etc. (I use a winch for the trailer and am careful in the pit/paddock/driveway.

    There are various installation issues such as making sure the clutch pedal stop is adjusted BEFORE the first time you depress the clutch to make sure you don't overtravel the pp.

    Keep in mind that a lighter flywheel is now SCCA legal. If you upgrade the clutch you might get a new flywheel at the same time that is already setup for the racing clutch. A skilled machinist who knows this stuff can do both to your existing flywheel.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    24 Aug 2011 08:45 AM

    I have given up on Nationals for this year at least.

    I want to refresh everything as much as possible and get back in action for a few more events this year if possible. Do the Tilton pp and disc save significant weight? I don't think I need a heavier duty clutch but saving some weight seems attractive if not too expensive. I intend to get the flywheel lightened to the extent of the rules when I have it in for the new ring gear.

    What about the engagement issue? I noticed Nick and some others have mentioned getting longer engagement through a shaft enhancement (heh!) or something similar.

    Thanks for the speedy response as usual Dick!

    t walgamuth
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    24 Aug 2011 09:07 AM
    Are the pilot bearing or throw out bearing stock ford pinto items?
    Locked
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    24 Aug 2011 09:12 AM
    We changed the master cylinder.. More travel to displace the same amount of fluid. This wouldn't have changed the amount of slave cyl travel.
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    24 Aug 2011 09:35 AM
    Locked wrote:
    We changed the master cylinder.. More travel to displace the same amount of fluid. This wouldn't have changed the amount of slave cyl travel.

    Nick,

    I think Tom was referring to the starter drive gear shaft not travelling far enough to fully engage the ring gear.

    Tom,

    If I'm correct about your question, I think you need to talk to an expert who has seen the various problems, causes, and solutions. I can guess at a few but nothing you probably haven't already considered. One thing to be sure of is whether or not something is preventing the drive gear from fully engaging rather than full extension not being far enough . . . i.e. if the shaft/gear "could" reach but is jammed/blocked in some way that it simply doesn't do so. I suspect that misalignment, mismatched gear size/count and stuff like that could be happening.

    Dick

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    24 Aug 2011 09:45 AM
    Tom,

    Regarding clutch weight savings it is several pounds static weight at least and since it is smaller OD there is less rotating weight. The flywheel can also be around 4 lbs or so lighter than in the past and the weight can be removed from the od which helps with rotating weight.


    Talk to a clutch vendor like Keith or Taylor about the version. The biggest variable is the spring pressure. Pedal pressure can be a concern but since we don't necessarily need the "fastest acting" clutch (i.e. smallest possible pedal movement) you can go to a smaller master cylinder and also a smaller OD release bearing to compensate for the heavier pp springs. Its all about leverage.
    t walgamuth
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    24 Aug 2011 10:50 AM

    The starter provides about a half inch of thrust on its drive gear to engage the flywheel. Unfortunately it sits far enough from the ring gear that it only engages about 1/3 of the face of the ring gear. We calculate we need another 3/8" of extension to get the starter gear close enough to fully engage the ring gear. this will take a longer gear or a way to mount the starter closer to the ring gear. The custom adapter appears to be about the thickness needed to get full engagement of the starter gear. Unfortunately the starter will not mount to my bell housing without it.

    My clutch is cable operated....no hydraulics.

    t walgamuth
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    24 Aug 2011 10:33 PM

    Ok so I started to remove the back end of the car. Some issues:

    1. an ear broke off the block near the starter mount.

    2. I can't figure out how the clutch cable will come through the adapter around the flywheel so the adapter will come off.

    3. The adapter with all 8 obvious mounting bolts does not show any looseness. There must be some hidden fasteners or it may have some locating sleeves or pins that are holding it tight.

    Any ideas?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    25 Aug 2011 07:47 AM
    Tom,

    You probably need to talk with a Reynard expert such as Keith or Larry. I don't recall how many bolts and studs hold my 85 oil tank/bellhousing/adapter casting on but 8 sounds reasonable. If you are absolutely sure that there are no hidden bolts or studs you might try tapping a putty knife blade between the adapter and the block - very carefully. I had to do that last fall on mine.

    How did the block ear break? I don't know how fixable they are, especially with an assembled engine.

    Dick
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    25 Aug 2011 09:42 AM

    The ear was broken but it was not obvious because of lack of good visibility down there. when I loostened the nut from the stud the broken piece fell off.

    I will have my favorite machinist come by and look at it to see if it is feasible to repair in the car.

    jchiu
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    25 Aug 2011 10:50 PM
    Sorry to hear of all this trouble and having to abandon your plans to go to nat'ls Tom. If I was still back there I'd help ya turn a wrench. Good luck on getting it back to health!
    boardkat
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    26 Aug 2011 04:02 AM
    damn :(
    t walgamuth
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    26 Aug 2011 08:44 AM
    Thanks guys!
    Locked
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    26 Aug 2011 09:14 AM
    Tom, I wish you were closer... I'd give a hand.
    t walgamuth
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    26 Aug 2011 04:07 PM
    Thanks Nick!
    t walgamuth
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    27 Aug 2011 11:17 AM

    OK. I found the two bolts that were holding on the rear end. It goes from through all the suspension points and right into the frame so that it all is not just hanging from the back of the motor. Its loose now so I am going to go pull it all off.

    Wish me luck!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    27 Aug 2011 09:43 PM
    Tom,

    Great. Those designers are really tricky about where they hide stuff. Perfectly logical . . . after we find the hiding places.

    Now all you have to do is remember where they all go when you put it back together again. (easier said than done).

    Dick
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    27 Aug 2011 11:08 PM

    After loostenening those I found two more bolts running from the bottom of the dry sump casting into the adapter plate. Then it all came right off. I found the pp fairly worn and the disc in good shape. I pulled it off and supported it with my big floor jack. balancing it with one hand and maneuvering it with the other hand I pushed it to the side of the garage and supported it with two wheels lying flat and a large block of wood.

    I think my t/o bearing is binding up though. In my research I preliminarily believe that the clutch and pp are cortina. The t/o bearing appears to be air cooled vw. Pilot I don't know but will guess is ford. The flywheel is stock so we can take some weight off it and still be legal.

    After looking closer at the distributor, I believe that it has the wrong distributor cap. It appears to be for a distributor that is abou 1/8" larger diameter, so with the clips attached you can move the distributor cap all around. I am amazed that the car ran at all. There is no vac advance and the mechanical advance seems pretty minimal. The distributor is ford.

    I see that some engines have bosch distributors. I am hoping to find a bosch for my engine as I am more familiar with them.

    Tomorrow I plan to pull the valve cover and check my valves and springs. I think I have a weak cylinder. I suspect a bent valve or damaged valve spring.

    Locked
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    27 Aug 2011 11:41 PM
    Good progress.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    28 Aug 2011 08:03 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I found the pp fairly worn and the disc in good shape.

    I think my t/o bearing is binding up though. In my research I preliminarily believe that the clutch and pp are cortina. The t/o bearing appears to be air cooled vw. Pilot I don't know but will guess is ford. The flywheel is stock so we can take some weight off it and still be legal.

    After looking closer at the distributor, I believe that it has the wrong distributor cap. It appears to be for a distributor that is abou 1/8" larger diameter, so with the clips attached you can move the distributor cap all around. I am amazed that the car ran at all. There is no vac advance and the mechanical advance seems pretty minimal. The distributor is ford.

    I see that some engines have bosch distributors. I am hoping to find a bosch for my engine as I am more familiar with them.


    Tom,

    I recommend that you source ALL replacement parts through one or more of the top FF parts suppliers to make sure you get the right quality and the right parts. Keith, Larry, Pegasus, etc. Even though they may be more expensive than the cheapest "it seems right" parts you will be better off with the known good stuff. There is enough competition between racing vendors that their prices will be fair. Plus you just need to call and they know exactly what you need.

    The Bosch distributors are certainly the favorites. The are modified to be mechanical only. The best source again is guys mentioned above. Ditto for the clutch cable and the T/O bearing.

    If you stay with the stock type I would replace the clutch disc even though it seems good. Nothing like a matched set.

    Dick




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    29 Aug 2011 09:06 AM
    I wonder if the clutch cable is VW?
    t walgamuth
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    29 Aug 2011 04:44 PM
    I ordered about $500 worth of parts today. So I will get the flywheel surfaced and lightened and hopefully before the week is over I can start putting it all back together.;)
    Dick Rasmussen
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    29 Aug 2011 09:43 PM
    Tom,

    If it helps, once you get everything "fresh" and healthy, it should stay that way for many years . . . like mine.

    Good luck on the distributor. However the Autolite that you apparently have is probably "decent" unless it is worn out. Maybe all it needs is a high quality cap and the usual tuneup stuff. Its not like we need that last HP or 2 at 6500 rpm on a long road race straight.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    30 Aug 2011 06:03 AM

    So I took the flywheel over to my favorite machinists and had him look it over. After a while he decided that the ring gear is on backwards for a "conventional' starter location which is in front of the flywheel. After discussing it we decided it must have originally been mounted that way for a "pull" gear characteristic of a Lucas starter. So it looks like we can flip the ring gear around and be good to go.

    I have located a slightly used distributor (Bosch) that I am in negotiation for. I think I will go for that. The hot setup for a Bosch is to have the vac advance removed and the plates welded, leaving just the centrifugal advance?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    30 Aug 2011 06:33 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    The hot setup for a Bosch is to have the vac advance removed and the plates welded, leaving just the centrifugal advance?

    Yes. :-)

    Set static timing for between 38 - 40 degrees total after all the advance "kicks in above 3 - 4K rpm or so. I don't recall point gap.

    Dick

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    31 Aug 2011 08:40 AM

    Upon further reflection I doubt that flipping the ring gear will result in the precuts on the ring gear being on the correct side of the tooth.

    so I ordered a new one.

    t walgamuth
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    02 Sep 2011 11:01 PM

    Today my Bosch distributor and the new rev limiting rotor came in. I also got the car back from Michael's place with a restored block ear. The stripped place in the adaptor we believe I can drill out and through bolt.

    Michael also did a leak down for me and found all cylinders looking good so the fluffed plug was apparently due to the distributor issues.

    I lack my new ring gear so it looks to be a thrash to get it all back together for the 11th.

    t walgamuth
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    06 Sep 2011 06:45 AM
    So yesterday I noticed that the pressure plate I bought is not the same dimensions as the one which came in the car. It is the same diameter but the distance from the face of it to the top of the clutch fingers is 1/4" deeper so it won't work. I suspect this is the difference between a cortina clutch and the pinto clutch. So today I have to find and verify the correct dimensions on a new pp and get it here in time to get it all back together for Sunday.
    t walgamuth
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    06 Sep 2011 10:21 PM

    Today I ordered another pressure plate.

    When I got home from work I found my new ring gear and flywheel bolts. Tomorrow they go to the machine shop and the starter goes to the starter shop to be rebuilt again.

    Every day is like christmas with all these parts showing up on my porch.

    Locked
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    07 Sep 2011 09:36 AM
    I like early christmas!
    t walgamuth
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    08 Sep 2011 04:47 PM
    My flywheel is ready, and the starter. I will go pick them up after work. the clutch pp is supposed to be at my house today as well. It looks like fairly good chance to be ready to go on sunday.;)
    t walgamuth
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    10 Sep 2011 06:56 AM

    I took a vacation day yesterday and worked on the car. When getting ready to install the throw out bearing I found to my surprise the old one is not frozen. I also discovered what a "bobbin" is. It is a spacer which goes between the to bearing and the pp. It coasts along on the input shaft of the transaxle. The throw out lever I found to have worn into the sides of the case enough that it could float back and forth at least a quarter of an inch, allowing the bobbin to be misaligned with the to bearing.

    I found some C clips at Ace hardware and installed them on the shaft so the float is minimized. I will re-attach the clutch cable at one hole lower on the lever so it interferes with the spring less. I believe all this fine tuning will result in a good working clutch without the groaning at the starting line when sitting there with it held in.

    I cleaned the inside of the bell housing, bolted on the pp with the disc inside and am ready to bolt it all on the back of the car today. Then I will install the starter and my new Bosch distributor and hopefully be ready to go for tomorrow.

    t walgamuth
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    10 Sep 2011 04:41 PM

    Today I struggled with getting the transaxle to slide into the pilot bearing. I had to take it back off and go back in a couple of times. I finally got it in and seated, along with replacing some inappropriate fasteners, etc. Then I realized I had not fastened the pivot bolts on the upper suspension. They would not go in and start so I guess it all has to come loose and go back in so I can get them started.

    It now looks doubtful for being ready to go tomorrow. I am pooped and will not have the energy to work til 11 and get up at 6 to go race like I would have had 15 years ago.

    I will probably go out after supper and at least look and think but probably not get back into it since I cannot finish in time in any case. So tomorrow I will work on my 2010 taxes since I have to have them done by the fifteenth.

    Locked
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    10 Sep 2011 08:07 PM
    Tom, sorry to hear.. I've been hopeful..

    Maybe plan on making it to Blytheville. I know Mark, Don(& co-driver), and I plan to attend. We're also thinking about renting out the Dulon. Chambers said Ben wants to go too.
    t walgamuth
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    10 Sep 2011 08:57 PM

    October 1 and 2?

    Maybe. I'll have to see how it goes from here.

    t walgamuth
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    17 Sep 2011 05:15 PM

    I worked on an Architectural consulting job this morning.

    After lunch I pulled the rear end back enough to insert some spacer washers where the frame bolts to the adapter then buttoned that all up. Then I put on my new Bosch blue coil and my nearly new Bosch distributor complete with a 6700 RPM rev limiting rotor.

    I won't be done to run tomorrow but will work on the car tomorrow and hopefully get it all squared away to run again next weekend. I really did not want to get into all this until the winter lay over but the starter/flywheel failure pretty much forced most of it.

    I still need to set the timing, install the clutch cable and the shift linkage.

    I'd also like to do some painting on the suspension and frame.

    t walgamuth
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    17 Sep 2011 07:01 PM

    The old race car rule strikes again!

    When I removed the coil the bracket holding it came off in three pieces. When I examined it I found it had been welded before. I went to Napa and got a new bracket. It appears to be lighter than the origainal one. Heh!

    t walgamuth
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    18 Sep 2011 03:52 PM

    Today I struggled a bit to refit the starter as there was a bit of a blob of iron where Michael had rebuilt the ear on my block so I had to grind and file to achieve a fit.

    I also put in the distributor, being careful to try and put it back in the same position that the old distributor was in. Then installed the plug wires and the starter wires. Once I got all that hooked up I tried to start it. It was reluctant until I hooked up the plus wire on the little battery.

    Then I cranked it over then applied a bit of ether and it started right up.;)

    After a few minutes of idling I found it would rev up as it should. Then I turned it off and tried to apply the timing light to fine tune the timing. I could not see any of the timing marks.

    The back of the flywheel where the marks are is pretty far back in the opening provided for looking at them and it apparently is not close enough to see them, so I am wondering if there is another way to time it other than a timing light on the flywheel?

    Locked
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    18 Sep 2011 05:49 PM
    Tom, glad to hear she runs again! Not sure on the timing?..
    t walgamuth
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    18 Sep 2011 07:44 PM

    Correct.

    There are timing marks on the fw but they are obscured by the location of the peep hole in the adapter. Any chance there are marks on the front of the motor?

    It was truly great to hear her run again! Very encouraging!

    Don Elzinga
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    18 Sep 2011 08:06 PM

    Tom,

    I've had bad luck with those rev limiting rotors. Started causing a high speed misfire after less than a full season of running. I went to the rotor because I could never get the MSD rev limiter to work. So I bought a Pertronix rev limiter, which has worked great ever since.

    Don

    t walgamuth
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    18 Sep 2011 09:12 PM
    Don, did you run more than one?
    Dick Rasmussen
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    18 Sep 2011 10:24 PM
    Tom,

    I ran a rev limiting rotor in my Lotus Europa. In Street Prepared I adjusted it to higher than stock revs but it was variable due to weather conditions and spark plug "freshness". Fortunately the rev limit went UP with fresh plugs which I always had for major events and up in better weather when you have traction.

    I tried one in the Formula Ford last summer and didn't like it. I tend to hit the limiter for a couple of seconds at the end of straights and really prefer a "soft cut" type limiter. I had good luck with an MSD (only took it out as a preemptive "preventative" measure but I seem to be the exception . . . maybe because I didn't run as much as other guys like Don and Peter C. My first limiter and my current limiter are the microdynamics units that Pegasus sold (my first one) and sells (my current one). Both worked well. I replaced the first one with the MSD to get easier adjustibility since the old microdynamics needed to be sent to Pegasus for adjustment. The current Microdynamics is tiny and easy to adjust. Pricey though.

    FYI I still run points and can easily disconnect the rev limiter between runs since the coil is outside the engine compartment and the rev limiter is connected with a quick connect to the coil.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    19 Sep 2011 04:07 AM
    Did you run the Bosch rev limiting rotor or another brand? (if other brands are available). What rpm was it set to work at and what did it tend to actually work at?
    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 Sep 2011 06:28 AM

    The Lotus used a stock Lucas rotor in the stock Lucas distributor which I modified by removing "weight" screws and/or drilling a hole in the moving weight. It was set by me in Street Prepared for about 7500 under ideal conditions. Stock was around 6500 to 6800 as I recall (very long time ago).


    The FF used an Ivey sourced Bosch set for 7k (I thought). The one time I ran it the limit was around 7200. However Jay's wife was extremely sick when I ordered it so it may have stayed at the normal setting of 7200 since her health may have been his primary focus.

    I changed mostly due to the lack of electronic soft cut.

    At this point I would say a rev limit rotor is certainly better than none at all. Then if you find that you do tend to run to redline then budget for a better electronic one. Especially since you already own the rotor.

    The rotor type is great for road racers who are only looking to protect if they end up in neutral during an upshift. They are not likely to hit the limiter anywhere nearly as often as we can. Their typical first gear is more like our typical 3rd or 4th so revs climb much more slowly.

    We tend to need a rev limiter because we simply are too busy to shift (or know that we should/could shift) or the remaining distance before slowing is too short to be worth it.

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    19 Sep 2011 08:39 AM
    Thanks Dick!
    Don Elzinga
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    19 Sep 2011 09:47 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Don, did you run more than one?

    No, I bought that one, and I remember the guy I bought it from warning me that they'd had issues with every one they'd tried. If I recall correctly, I got it from Tom Andresen. Sure enough, halfway through the season I got a high speed misfire that went away when I swapped back to the solid rotor. Same issue with the MSD limiter; engine would break up above like 4000 RPM, no matter what pill was in it. So I ran with no limiter for a couple seasons, until I put in the Pertronix box.

    t walgamuth
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    19 Sep 2011 10:34 PM
    And the one you ran was a Bosch too?
    Dick Rasmussen
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    19 Sep 2011 11:22 PM
    I wonder what the problem is with the Bosch (assuming a Bosch distributor needs a Bosch rev limiting rotor).

    These things were oem for many Porsches, etc. "in the day". I never had an issue with my Lucas rotors other than the ones stated above. The concept is simply . . . centrifugal force shorts the spark to the distributor shaft. I would expect "binding" preventing the shorting mechanism from moving. Misfire at much lower rpm implies a different issue. However I never really compared the Bosch mechanism to my memory of the Lucas approach.

    Dick
    Don Elzinga
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    20 Sep 2011 07:00 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    And the one you ran was a Bosch too?

    Yes, it's a Bosch. There's some kind of potted electronics between the center section (where the spring loaded weight is) and the tip. Not sure what's in there, or why this rotor causes misfire. I don't see any carbon tracks to the shorting post, but I don't have a high tension coil tester to check it with.

    t walgamuth
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    20 Sep 2011 11:48 AM
    Thansk Don and Dick!
    t walgamuth
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    22 Sep 2011 10:38 PM

    What is the recommended spec on brake fluid for these English calipers?

    After looking over at Apexspeed, apparently, some use dot 3 and some dot 4.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    23 Sep 2011 07:52 AM
    Easy. Castrol LMA if available. Otherwise Valvoline is a good option that seems to have similar wet boiling point specs. You are NOT going to overheat the fluid in autocross. Dot 3, Dot 4, or "combo" like many are these days. However, you also do not need to bleed the brakes frequently . . . just flush the system every couple of years to get rid of old fluid that may have absorbed moisture.
    t walgamuth
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    23 Sep 2011 04:46 PM
    Of course I am not worried about boiling my fluid (heh!) but I am worried about the wrong fluid eating up my caliper or mc seals.
    t walgamuth
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    24 Sep 2011 02:20 PM

    I got some valvoline yesterday.....turns out to be dot 3 and 4!;)

    I got the shift linkage hooked up yesterday. I drilled out the u joint hookup hole and put in next size larger bolt. While drilling I was holding the linkage and the drill bound up and pinched the palm of my hand bewteen the rod and the transaxle...Ouch! It didn't break anything but raised an impressive bump on the back of my hand! After that I tried without success to feed my clutch cable back through the guide hole in the tranny adapter....finally exhausting myself and giving up for the evening.

    I will to try to finish now and perhaps run someplace tomorrow.

    t walgamuth
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    24 Sep 2011 11:10 PM

    I got the shift linkage together and found it to be much more positive with the new bolt. I will turn my attention to the shift lever mechanism later.

    I also had to bleed the rear brakes since the rear of the car was off. I found the rod to the master cylinder for the rear was not adjusted the same as the front and had been preventing the rears from bleeding correctly. After adjusting that we got it to bleed out solidly. I got my Mrs to help bleed it. Afterword she didn't want out of the car very much. It was too comfy!

    I then looked at the distributor and decided that the timing is pretty far retarded. I will have another look at that tomorrow.

    t walgamuth
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    25 Sep 2011 07:37 PM

    After further thought I believe it is advanced. Now I will have to determine how much. The distributor turns at half crank speed, right? So if I want thirty degrees total advance is that at the crank or the distributor. It must be at the crank since that is where the marks reside. So if I want thirteen degrees static advance that is thirteen degrees of crank travel.

    360 degrees divided by 110 teeth = 3.27 degreees per tooth or about four teeth to make 13 degrees for the initial advance. Then if we want 33 degrees total advance that would be ten teeth.

    I have it at TDC now so to set the correct initial advance I will need to back the engine up four teeth and set the distributor to point at the #1 cylinder. Or is the notch in the edge of the distributor supposed to coincide with TDC?

    OK, I checked my 1071 Chilton's Foreign car repair manual and the notch is to coincide with the #1 cylinder lead.

    Now does the cylinder coincide with the center of the rotor contact or the front edge? On the motorola rotor I took out it seemed to have all its wear on the leading edge.

    pru
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    26 Sep 2011 07:35 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    360 degrees divided by 110 teeth = 3.27 degreees per tooth or about four teeth to make 13 degrees for the initial advance. Then if we want 33 degrees total advance that would be ten teeth.

    Tom,

    Additional input : Kent ignition timing

    Dick Rasmussen
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    26 Sep 2011 07:35 AM
    Tom,

    No luck with finding access to timing marks so that you can use a timing light?

    Don't forget that the timing numbers Pru quoted are for full advance. You are measuring static timing.You will need to know what the full centrifugal advance is for a prep'd distributor.

    I don't know if there is an accurate "rotor points here" way to check timing other than a first cut at getting the distributor positioned within the adjustment range of the clamp.

    Here is a link to "static timing" for a VW aircooled. I've never tried it. Basically the test light goes out when the points start to open.

    http://www.aircooledtech.com/timing/static/


    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 10:06 AM

    Thanks for the excellent responses!

    I now can see the timing lights with the fw sitting still. I plan to use the counting teeth method and mark my timing on the other side of the flywheel so I can see it with the timing light.

    I think I have it in my mind now.

    I am now thinking I may need to change the wheel bearings in the rr wheel.

    Is your car a reynard PRU? Pegasus does not list the bearing size for the Reynard but I assume it is the same as one of the other brands of chassis.

    Clemens
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    26 Sep 2011 12:20 PM

    Tom,

    When/if you replace the wheel bearing, don't do one wheel at a time. Replace the bearings in at least both rear wheels.

    You should be able to order the correct bearings based on the markings you find on your bearings upon disassembly. This assumes that the last guy who replaced the bearings installed the correct ones. Any good bearing supply house should be able to help you with that.

    Clemens

    pru
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    26 Sep 2011 12:23 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Is your car a reynard PRU? Pegasus does not list the bearing size for the Reynard but I assume it is the same as one of the other brands of chassis.

    Tom,

    I run a Swift which the 85 Reynard was intended to copy. At one time, I did own a 85 Reynard.

    As for wheel bearings for the 85 Reynard, they are very expensive / hard to source. I suggest contacting either Keith Averill or Larry Oliver for additional information.

    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 03:31 PM
    Thank you gentlemen!
    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 03:31 PM
    Thank you gentlemen!
    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 03:31 PM
    Thank you gentlemen!
    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 03:32 PM
    Thank you gentlemen!
    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 03:32 PM
    Thank you gentlemen!
    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 03:32 PM
    Thank you gentlemen!
    t walgamuth
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    26 Sep 2011 03:32 PM
    Thank you gentlemen!
    Jim G
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    26 Sep 2011 10:39 PM
    You're welcome ... welcome ... welcome ...
    t walgamuth
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    27 Sep 2011 10:13 AM

    Heh!

    My computer did that. I wondered why it took so long to post.;)

    t walgamuth
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    27 Sep 2011 10:28 PM

    I took my "spare" upright and wheel bearing into my favorite machinist for him to have a look at.

    You know the rule about spares for a race car? The one that says better figure they are all junk? Heh!

    The wheel bearing is about to fall apart and the upright is seriously gouged and a new bearing will probably not stay in it for long, so on Friday I will be taking it all apart so we can see if the stub axle is worn too much and what else is F'd up.

    Never a dull moment with old race cars!;)

    t walgamuth
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    07 Oct 2011 07:52 PM

    So I got it all apart except I cannot seem to get the axle and cv joint to come out of the upright. I see a snap ring but it is on the inside of the stub axle from the cv joint. I don't see how that will help to remove.

    Anybody know what to do from here?

    Don Elzinga
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    07 Oct 2011 09:11 PM

    On the Reynard there is a hub nut on the outside of the spindle (behind the wheel and centerlock nut). You take that off and the spindle and drive bell slip out of the hub toward the inside. Then you pull the snap ring and press the bearing out. Is yours different from that? Can you post pictures?

    Don

    t walgamuth
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    08 Oct 2011 08:07 AM

    My car has four lugs per wheel.

    There is an aluminum hub with the four bolts (lug studs) which hold the wheel on. There are six little countersunk allen head bolts which serve to "spline" the hub to the inner part. There is a very large allen head bolt which holds the hub to the stub axle (I believe).

    From the inside I have removed the six small allens holding the boot and slid that toward the transaxle. The splined axle slides into the cv joint it appears. There is a snap ring on the outside of the cv joint which does not appear to benefit the attempted disassembly process to remove. The cv joint has now twisted enough that one of the large balls has come out.

    It appears that there is a part with the six holes that receive the above mentioned six stud "spline" that appears to be pressed into the bearing. The wheel seems to have been rubbing on the outside of the upright and the corners of the calipers. This seems to indicate looseness in the wheel bearing.

    I'll try to post some pics. I am not very competant at that though.

    Thanks Don!

    Don Elzinga
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    08 Oct 2011 09:12 AM

    If the six bolts on the inner side only hold the boot in place, that suggests to me that you have the type of CV joint where the stub axle is part of the joint. The snap ring on the inboard side of the CV stops the halfshaft from sliding too far into the joint. It's the snap ring on the other side you need to remove to get the halfshaft out of the CV joint. But that wouldn't help with getting the bearing out of the upright. There has to be something holding the wheel drive flange onto the stub axle; usually it's a large nut. Your description makes it sound like there's a large allen head bolt serving that function. I would remove that bolt. On my car the drive flange is pressed into the hub bearing. There are a pair of 1/4-28 holes through the flange where you can use a pair of grade 8 or similar bolts to push the flange out of the bearing race.

    Don

    t walgamuth
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    08 Oct 2011 10:20 AM
    Thanks Don. I'll take a look.
    t walgamuth
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    08 Oct 2011 03:40 PM
    I was just thinking maybe I can pull the entire half shaft along with the upright and take it all to the machine shop and let them figure out how to get it apart. There is not a snap ring inside the transaxle that holds in the half shaft is there?
    Don Elzinga
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    08 Oct 2011 04:25 PM

    Long time since I've pulled the drive flanges out of my transaxle, but I think there's a circlip on the inside of the bearing. So you pull the whole side cover, then the circlip, then the drive flange and it's shaft come out of the bearing. But you don't need to take them out at all unless the transaxle itself needs repair. Just unbolt the inboard CV from the drive flange.

    Don

    t walgamuth
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    08 Oct 2011 05:55 PM

    OK, that sounds doable.

    Thanks Don!

    t walgamuth
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    17 Oct 2011 04:56 AM

    Yesterday I removed the inner cv joint along with the half shaft, the outer cv and the upright. I also found a picture which lacks enough detail to be certain but seems to indicate there is a snap ring on both sides of the place the cv joint slips over the half shaft. I will take that all to my favorite machinist and ask him to get the outer cv off the half shaft and remove the wheel bearing from the upright.

    I also took off the left rear spring and shock and moved the pivot through its range of motion to see why it binds. It seems to have some areas which have more resistance than others but I can move it with my bare hands, not needing a lever. There is a small crack on the pivot so I will remove it from the chassis and get that welded.

    Then I will change all four springs. I am going to go to softer springs all around in hopes of increasing grip.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    17 Oct 2011 07:56 AM
    Tom,

    As far as I know there is, in fact, a snap ring holding the CVs on the half shaft. One on both sides of each CV I think. It has been a long time but my recollection is that they do not have the little holes for a snap ring pliers tip . . . lots of opportunities to use @*#$% words and/or bandaids. If you ever do the removal/re-installation it helps to "deburr" any rough spots that show up in the process. Otherwise the CV may be a challenge to slide back on.



    t walgamuth
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    17 Oct 2011 09:15 AM
    Thanks Dick!
    Don Elzinga
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    17 Oct 2011 10:37 PM

    Depends on the shaft. Some have a shoulder on the inner side, the cut to length ones you put a groove where you need it and use another snap-ring on the inner side of the joint. Only reason to pull the CV off the shaft is if the CV or the boot are shot. CVs last a long time, as long as you open them up and dry them out any time they get water in them. Rust kills them quickly.

    Does your car have rockers on shafts with "Nadella" bearings (hat shaped needle bearings)? If they're binding in spots, the pivot shaft is probably shot. If they don't have play in the bearings you can probably get by with just keeping them well lubed. I put new ones in my car 10+ years ago and they still feel like new. I suspect the brinelling of the shaft was either crash damage (from my car's road-racing past), or somebody ran them dry for a while.

    t walgamuth
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    17 Oct 2011 11:18 PM

    It seems not to have any needle bearings but be just steel on steel bearing surfaces. The binding is not severe. I am going to get the crack in the rocker welded as I think it might deform and bind under load.

    Thanks Don!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    18 Oct 2011 07:56 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    It seems not to have any needle bearings but be just steel on steel bearing surfaces. The binding is not severe. I am going to get the crack in the rocker welded as I think it might deform and bind under load.

    Thanks Don!

    Tom,

    I checked one of the Reynard manuals that I sent to you shortly after you bought the car. The manual calls the bushings used in the front and rear upper wishbone pivots "DU Bushes" and to lubricate with Copperslip. Here is a description of what Google found with a search. The manual by the way talks about the tool to use for installation.

    http://www.bearingbush.com/du.html

    FYI my 85 VD uses ball bearings.

    Hope this helps.

    Don Elzinga
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    18 Oct 2011 08:06 PM
    There's got to be some kind of bushing in there. My fronts are a simple nylon bushing. If it's sticky, I'd disassemble and find out what's wrong. If it's worn down to steel on steel, it's just going to get worse, quickly.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    18 Oct 2011 08:15 PM
    Tom,

    As Don says if the bushings are down to steel they will bind under load. I suspect from what the manual says however that there will be a lot of play if the bearing surface materials are gone. Copperslip (or possibly Copaslip in the US http://www.molyslip.com/products/an...-compound/ ) is good stuff and may be readily available in good autoparts stores. I still have a tube purchased in 1992 or so when installing new hub bearings in my uprights.
    t walgamuth
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    18 Oct 2011 10:30 PM

    I pulled off the bell crank which transfers the load from the push rod to the top of the coil over tonight. The pivots do have some variation of a bushing in there...like the ones that Dick linked. The attachment to the top of the coil over is where the cracks are and it looks as if the two sides can compress onto the top of the coil over which is a sort of heim joint, so it would just pinch the center of the heim I believe and will not cause any trouble. I also checked the specifications on the push rods and found them to be the same length and within 1/16" of the length specified in the material I have. I believe if I had the car set up with the rake they suggest the length would be spot on.

    The bell crank is made of some seriously thin metal....it looks to be about 1/16" thick. I'll take it in tomorrow and have my machinist look at it and make a recommendation on who to get to weld it. If nobody locally looks right for the job I can always take it to the Maestro, Michael LeVeque.

    t walgamuth
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    20 Oct 2011 10:00 PM

    The new bearing arrived today. I took it over to the machine shop. I am hoping to get it back tomorrow.

    I then removed the front coil overs and switched to the softer springs. I found the bottom mount bolts one size undersize so will have to get the correct ones tomorrow at Ace.

    This car is a pleasure to work on. The easiest I have ever worked on in many ways.

    t walgamuth
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    21 Oct 2011 10:12 PM

    Today my machinist called and said I needed another part....the thing that presses into the wheel bearing and the hub bolts to with the big allen screw. I just ordered one from Larry Oliver....ouch! Won't be here til next week.

    If I want to run any more events I may have to travel south.

    t walgamuth
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    22 Oct 2011 10:26 PM

    I went by the machine shop today and looked at the part that I had to order. It is different than I had imagined but makes more sense now that I understand it. The cv joint bolts to a fairly large flange on the inboard side of it while there are six holes for the drive pins to seat in. The large allen bolt that holds on the outer hub screws into it.

    The outer bearing failed and allowed the race to slip on the outer portion of the above part (maybe I'll call it the inner hub), allowing the inner hub outer area to get worn down enough to require it be replaced.

    harts
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    23 Oct 2011 07:56 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    The new bearing arrived today. I took it over to the machine shop. I am hoping to get it back tomorrow.

    I then removed the front coil overs and switched to the softer springs. I found the bottom mount bolts one size undersize so will have to get the correct ones tomorrow at Ace.

    This car is a pleasure to work on. The easiest I have ever worked on in many ways.

    what kind of wheel rates are you going to end up with the new springs

    t walgamuth
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    25 Oct 2011 04:36 PM

    Softer.

    Sorry, I gave up on trying to calculate it. They just aren't that hard to change if it is a disaster.

    Clemens
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    26 Oct 2011 07:52 AM

    Tom,

    I hope you remember where you borrowed the rear springs. ;)

    Clemens

    t walgamuth
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    26 Oct 2011 09:46 AM

    I do, thank you, Clemens. I have been pondering the best way to get them back to you. If you send me your address I will ship them.

    Tom

    twalgamuth@comcast.net

    Clemens
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    26 Oct 2011 05:58 PM

    Tom,

    Don't worry about shipping them for now. We might be able to work out another way to get them back to me. There's no rush.

    Clemens

    t walgamuth
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    26 Oct 2011 07:05 PM

    OK.

    Today I went over to my favorite machinist's shop and found he had pressed my wheel bearing into my upright, reconstructed the snap ring lip which my wheel had chewed off, and repaired the little cracks in my rocker assembly for the push rod suspension. Cool!

    I took the half shaft and cleaned both cv joints and got it all ready to put back on the car. I will do that at home and pack the cv at the same time.

    I will be ready to rock and roll before you know it!

    t walgamuth
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    12 Nov 2011 10:10 AM

    Other matters have interferred with the re-assembly process.

    Drat!

    I will miss this weekend's action. There is an event today and tomorrow at Rantoul too which is an easy drive.

    t walgamuth
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    24 Nov 2011 06:42 AM

    Other matters have been crowding out my time to work on the Reynard. I just received a significant job to work on which may prove to be a reliable source of income for the forseeable future so I may be able to move ahead with improving my FF and running it.

    Don, would you mind emailing me, please. I want to ask you a question about your fuel tank.

    twalgamuth@comcast.net

    t walgamuth
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    30 Jan 2012 11:53 AM

    So the winter has brought some work but the future is uncertain so I have not been doing much with the ford. I am getting energized now to at least get it all back together since if I decide to sell it I can.

    I have sold a big pile of Mercedes parts now and have some cash and am thinking of buying an aluminum head. Is there a consensus about this as to whether it can be recouped on sale time?

    Jim G
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    30 Jan 2012 02:27 PM
    It certainly makes your car more attractive to potential buyers. But it won't be a 1:1 return on your investment.
    t walgamuth
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    30 Jan 2012 11:20 PM

    Thank you!

    Tom

    t walgamuth
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    05 Feb 2012 07:02 AM
    I sent the body panels off to the shop to be professionally repaired and painted yesterday. I am going to begin putting it back together now. I am contemplating the purchase of an aluminum head for weight reduction and 2 more new panasport wheels.
    t walgamuth
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    06 Feb 2012 04:57 PM
    I ordered an aluminum head today.
    Dick Rasmussen
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    06 Feb 2012 09:12 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    I ordered an aluminum head today.

    Great! As I recall the weight savings is about 14 lbs. (I should do it but haven't).

    Will it come "assembled" with valves, springs, etc. or just the bare head?

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    07 Feb 2012 06:07 AM

    I've been told it is a 17# savings. It comes with guides installed and is supposed to be ready to transfer all parts from my old head onto it. The ports need to be matched, I believe too.

    My header is steel and getting a bit shaggy so I might consider going to stainless if they are lighter.

    t walgamuth
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    15 Feb 2012 06:01 AM

    The head arrived on Monday. It is about 17.8#. Doing a calculation on the assumption that it is exactly the same area in volumn as an iron head would result in a 30# + savings....so apparently the voided areas on it must have less air and more metal than on the iron version.

    The valves sit on the lower surface of it similar to a diesel head so the pistons must be cupped on top (?). An amazingly crude design (?). The intake passages clearly are rough so will need polishing a bit, the exhaust too.

    Shazam!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    15 Feb 2012 08:18 AM
    Tom,

    Bowl in piston certainly has disadvantages not the least of which in our engine is a lot of piston height/rock above the wrist pin causing bore and cylinder wall wear compared to newer designs.

    Here are rules relevant to port preparation:

    c. Cylinder Head
    1. Ports may be reshaped by the removal of metal as long as the
    port diameter at the manifold face of the head does not exceed
    the following dimensions:
    Inlet: 1.50” Exhaust: 1.20”
    2. The use of the Pierce aluminum cylinder head is permitted.
    3. The following head gaskets are allowed:
    A. Ford Part # 931M6051AA
    B. Payen Part # AH-750
    C. Felpro Part # 8360PT-1
    d. Inlet Manifold
    1. The ports may be reshaped by the removal of metal as long as
    the following dimensions are maintained:
    Maximum dimension at head face: 1.340”
    2. Carburetor Flange
    Maximum dimensions at carburetor flange: see Figure 1.
    3. The carburetor face of the inlet manifold may be machined to
    the horizontal to compensate for fore/aft tilt of the carburetor.
    4. Epoxy exposed in the manifold used to make repairs is acceptable,
    providing the total area is less than 0.75 square inches.
    5. The water passages in the inlet manifold may be plugged.
    Holes in the inlet manifold resulting from the removal of emission/
    vacuum lines shall be plugged.
    t walgamuth
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    15 Feb 2012 06:35 PM

    Thanks Dick!

    The head design has the virtue of simplicity and I suppose lightness.;)

    t walgamuth
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    19 Feb 2012 02:27 PM
    Today I am thinking about exhaust headers. Weight of stainless vs steel? Thinking stainless is stronger, does it follow that they are thinner, thus lighter?
    Clemens
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    19 Feb 2012 03:16 PM

    Tom,

    This article from Burns Stainless provides good insight in using stainless for headers:

    http://www.burnsstainless.com/stain...steel.aspx

    The article does not really mention the weight of the finished product, but I can see how a stainless header could be lighter than a mild steel header.

    You'll find more interesting info about headers here:

    http://www.burnsstainless.com/techarticles.aspx

    Clemens

    t walgamuth
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    19 Feb 2012 10:09 PM
    Thanks Clemens! I will take a look.
    t walgamuth
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    23 Feb 2012 06:32 AM

    I took the aluminum head over to my favorite machinist's yesterday. He looked it over and proclaimed it to be a quality piece. He thinks the ports look good too and only minor cleaning at the matchup to the intake will be needed. He suggested I buy new valves and springs so I would have a head that simply exchanges with the one I have. That sounded pretty good. He asked me what the cam lift is and what springs and valves to buy. I said I guessed stock since I do not plan to run it over 6500 rpm.

    Is this what is used? Stock valves and springs? I know we are allowed stronger springs to allow higher rpm but the extra springing on the valves will take some power away, right?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    23 Feb 2012 03:21 PM
    Here is what I would use unless a pro like Ivey indicated otherwise.

    https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/p...RecID=3539

    "Assume" that no matter what your best laid plans are for max revs of 6500 the engine will be rev'd significantly higher by accident or on purpose. :-)

    From a quick look at Pegasus (faster than the rule book) it looks like stock valves.

    Dick

    t walgamuth
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    23 Feb 2012 07:15 PM

    Thanks Dick!

    We'll probably go that way then.

    Tom

    t walgamuth
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    25 Feb 2012 01:08 PM
    I got the iron head off the engine today. It weighs 35.6# with valves and springs in it. I cannot imagine they weigh less than 3#. The aluminum head with no valves and springs weighed 17.8. I am getting a weight savings then of only 14.8#. Maybe someone has more accurate weight of the valves and springs. My 3# figure is an estimate after weighing some valves I have lying about.
    Don Elzinga
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    26 Feb 2012 10:09 PM
    Tom,
    Valves have to be absolutely stock. Just lightly breaking the sharp edge on the back side of the seat makes them illegal for FF. Can't remember valvespring rules off the top of my head. I would recommend getting an FF engine builder to assemble it for you, or at the very least have them thoroughly read the FF engine rules. For best power the rockers need to be tuned to get just under the max spec valve lift. This requires a special fixture to grind the tips square to the shaft.
    Don
    t walgamuth
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    26 Feb 2012 10:20 PM

    Oh, thanks Don. Are the engine rules in the road racing rule book?

    I saw all the eingine specs listed in the Pegasus catalogue and assumed them to apply for us. It does not mention the seat question you just mentioned though.

    I believe they list heavy duty springs and aluminum rockers and aluminum stands for the rocker shaft too.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    27 Feb 2012 01:39 PM
    Tom,

    The engine rules are in the "road racing GCR" under FF. As Don says, for engine builders who are not familiar with FF Kent engine rules giving them a copy of the engine rules pages is a good idea. EMPHASIZE that if the rules don't say you "can" you probably "cannot".

    I think the "seat sharp edge" comment probably meant on the valve but look at the rules to be sure.

    Dick
    Don Elzinga
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    27 Feb 2012 11:07 PM

    Yes, the sharp edge where the machined face (the part that seals on the valve seat) of the valve meets the backside of the head of the valve, if that makes more sense. Lots of other rules, too numerous to mention. Any good hotrodder could get 5-10 more hp out of one of these, and thereby turn a $12k race motor into about $50 worth of scrap. The beauty of the class is that no amount of $$$ can get you a big power advantage over everybody else. The downside is the rules are very picky. Another example; a scratch in the throat of the carburetor is an illegal modification. You have to buy a new carb body if it happens. Rules are in section 9.1.1.D.1 of the FCS; starting on page 238 of the GCR. The sharp edge rule (.f.2) simply states "Reshaping of the valves is specifically prohibited."

    Don

    t walgamuth
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    28 Feb 2012 06:38 AM
    Thank you! I will print off the rules for him!
    t walgamuth
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    10 Mar 2012 03:17 PM
    I tried to assemble my right half shaft today and found I had lost two of the cv joint balls. I found one of them in the garage but am still short one. anybody know if it is possible to buy one ball? it is about 11/16" diameter, my best guess.
    t walgamuth
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    11 Mar 2012 06:43 PM

    I have learned it is a Lobro style. I believe they came in 68ish VW's perhaps a superbeetle with the fully independent rear end. there are six evenly spaced attachment bolts at 78mm diameter pattern.

    Anybody have one of these cv's lying around?

    Dick Rasmussen
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    12 Mar 2012 07:37 AM
    Tom,

    There "used to be" a vendor who sold slightly undersize (for free movement) CV joint balls but I suspect that one or more of the vendors or racers who post on Apexspeed forums might have a "spare ball" :-) . . . or know what size ball to buy from a bearing supplier.


    If all else fails, the CV's themselves are about $65 from Pegasus and probably similar from other vendors. I just use the standard CV's.

    https://www.pegasusautoracing.com/p...oduct=1471

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    13 Mar 2012 06:41 AM

    I picked up a used one from a local Indie who services a lot of VW's.

    I took it over to my favorite machinist's shop yesterday evening and one of the crowd who collects there on a regular basis, who is a pretty damn fine machinist, turned it down like in the pictures. He got out 13 oz. of superfluous steel.

    I am energized now and pushing every day to complete the Reynard!

    t walgamuth
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    20 Mar 2012 06:38 AM
    I picked up my beautiful aluminum head yesterday. I found some tapped holes will be needed so I will have to trial fit it and mark where things are needed. I hope to do that today.
    t walgamuth
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    20 Mar 2012 07:38 PM

    The head with springs and so forth weighs less than it did to start with! So either I am not very good at weighing things or the setting up of the head took off more than the weight of the valves and springs!

    I am looking at the two heads now side by side to be sure everything will work. Does anybody know what the clearance is supposed to be between the valve and the piston at tdc?

    t walgamuth
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    22 Mar 2012 08:37 AM
    I measured and marked and drilled and tapped the holes at the front of the head to attach to the cross brace. I then went to Ace to find studs and nuts for the installation of manifolds, etc to the soft aluminum head.
    lharts
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    27 Mar 2012 09:49 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    The head with springs and so forth weighs less than it did to start with! So either I am not very good at weighing things or the setting up of the head took off more than the weight of the valves and springs!

    I am looking at the two heads now side by side to be sure everything will work. Does anybody know what the clearance is supposed to be between the valve and the piston at tdc?

    was going through some notes that i had gotten off of apex, , aluminum cylinder head tech stuff, curtis boggs i think this is the guy who made the heads or has something to do with them,, anyway the recommended valve lash was set them cold at .007-- .014, he said that the head heat dissipates so fast that it is almost impossible to set them hot

    t walgamuth
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    01 Apr 2012 09:56 PM
    Thanks Larry!
    t walgamuth
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    07 Apr 2012 05:11 PM
    Does anybody know if Michael Leveque can port my aluminum head? There is a restricted area inside the head compared to the iron head. I will guess it is about 1/8" less diameter at the small point. I suppose this might not matter at low rpm but at high rpm it would limit. I liked the way the old head performed so I would not want to change it much. I'd like to get the head installed soon so I need speedy service.
    t walgamuth
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    08 Apr 2012 08:35 AM

    Jimmy Chiu came by yesterday and we switched his wheels from street to race on his Miata. I have the street wheels now for sale....they are stock na 14 x 5.5" daisies in good shape with some decent but worn tires. He has taken a job with Honda and is working to help develop new technologies involving dynamics in their vehicles (if I tell you more than that he will have to kill you;)). He is living in Dublin Ohio a suburb of Colombus now and working in their plant in Marysville.

    He was in a hurry so we did not get to drink any bourbon but we had a nice conversation while swapping wheels about.

    It was good to see him and his lovely lady Marla.

    lharts
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    08 Apr 2012 02:30 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    Does anybody know if Michael Leveque can port my aluminum head? There is a restricted area inside the head compared to the iron head. I will guess it is about 1/8" less diameter at the small point. I suppose this might not matter at low rpm but at high rpm it would limit. I liked the way the old head performed so I would not want to change it much. I'd like to get the head installed soon so I need speedy service.

    check aluminum cylinder head tech notes , in apex speed before you start messing with the head

    nutty944
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    09 Apr 2012 06:07 AM
    If Michael can do it, I might be able to drop it off for you on Saturday. As long as this Saturday works for Michael, I'm headed over anyway. If he is going to the planning meeting on Tuesday, I could even bring it there. Just let me know if I can be of any help. 608-698-466one
    nutty944
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    09 Apr 2012 06:08 AM
    If Michael can do it, I might be able to drop it off for you on Saturday. As long as this Saturday works for Michael, I'm headed over anyway. If he is going to the planning meeting on Tuesday, I could even bring it there. Just let me know if I can be of any help. 608-698-466one
    t walgamuth
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    09 Apr 2012 06:26 AM
    OK, thanks Larry!
    t walgamuth
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    09 Apr 2012 06:28 AM
    OK, thanks for the kind offer, Chris!
    t walgamuth
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    14 Apr 2012 04:48 PM
    Today I went to my favorite machinists shop and used his tools to smooth my intake ports. The transition is now more smooth in general but in detail kindof bumpy. I think I will try to get an old fashoned sandpaper wheel cylinder hone to smooth out the lumps.
    t walgamuth
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    15 Apr 2012 01:11 PM
    I got it smoother and made it look as much as possible exactly like the iron head. I also had a couple of holes in the exhaust header welded, had it shot blasted and painted it with the right kind of flat black paint. I'll try to complete my battery relocate next.
    jchiu
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    15 Apr 2012 03:19 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Jimmy Chiu came by yesterday and we switched his wheels from street to race on his Miata. I have the street wheels now for sale....they are stock na 14 x 5.5" daisies in good shape with some decent but worn tires. He has taken a job with Honda and is working to help develop new technologies involving dynamics in their vehicles (if I tell you more than that he will have to kill you;)). He is living in Dublin Ohio a suburb of Colombus now and working in their plant in Marysville.

    He was in a hurry so we did not get to drink any bourbon but we had a nice conversation while swapping wheels about.

    It was good to see him and his lovely lady Marla.

    Just minor clarification on this post, I am working for Honda Research Institute in sunny California. Happened to be in the midwest last month on business at Honda R&D Americas, but now happily back on the left coast. The Miata is on a truck en route to norcal as we speak (thanks to Tom for helping out with the logistics!).

    IndySCCA will always hold a special place in my heart. The two years racing alongside you guys have been nothing short of a blast. I wish you guys all the best in your future endeavors and will continue lurking through the threads to see what new is happening with the club.

    If anyone finds themselves in the bay area, shoot me a message to go karting or grab some good local brew.


    All the best,



    t walgamuth
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    22 Apr 2012 08:20 AM

    Slow progress. I got the base installed for the battery relocate. Will try to get cables attached in new location today and move on to mechanical things.

    I will probably be looking to sell this car after getting it back together and sorted, so if there is anybody out there in the market give me a call.

    Tom Walgamuth

    765 490 0275

    nutty944
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    22 Apr 2012 07:32 PM
    That was a brief stay in CM. Plans for a different car yet?
    t walgamuth
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    25 Apr 2012 06:40 AM

    I might dust off the Miata and run STR.

    If my financial situation stabilizes I will keep the Reynard. I'd like to get it sorted and reliable.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    25 Apr 2012 08:56 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I might dust off the Miata and run STR.

    If my financial situation stabilizes I will keep the Reynard. I'd like to get it sorted and reliable.

    Tom,

    If the financial situation is "stable enough" to keep the car and you really like it simply "park it" as needed for "awhile". Mine was mostly parked for 10 years and will finally be active again at national events this year.


    t walgamuth
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    30 Apr 2012 06:49 AM

    It looks promising this week. I have a couple of things cooking which will help tremendously if it all gells. I will at minimum put it all together with what I have done this winter in lightening and upgrades. If the finances allow I would love to put in new hubs all around and light brakes to finish it off right. In any case I plan to run it this summer as a minimum to show it is sound prior to sale.

    It's fun to work on but the bulletproof Miata was great because it never broke on track and working on it consisted of mainly making it better.

    Dick Rasmussen
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    30 Apr 2012 08:25 AM
    Tom,

    Sounds like a "plan". FYI my FF has been bulletproof except for a couple of fuel cell related issues after too many years of "sitting around". However, we went through it completely when purchased in 1991. Knock on wood.


    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    30 Apr 2012 07:11 PM

    I had every confidence it was bulletproof until the wheel fell off!

    yikes!

    Dick Rasmussen
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    30 Apr 2012 08:11 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I had every confidence it was bulletproof until the wheel fell off!

    yikes!

    Oh, I had one wheel fall off . . . due to me not torquing the one lug nut. Oops! Your car was raced for many years so stuff is bound to be worn out. Mine went from road racing to autocross after only six years so that helps.


    t walgamuth
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    02 May 2012 06:16 AM

    It was my aluminum hub. Actually if I were more experienced I would have caught it before the wheel actually fell off if I had noticed the signs. the hub actually was broken in probably three places for a good while but did not fall off because the brake caliper and rotor gave support.

    Then the starter failed....and I found the flywheel was on backwards....actually the ring gear, and next thing you know, here we are and I just got busy with paying work in the last week so will miss the first Indy event almost certainly....and daughter #3 is havig surgery tomorrow and daughter #4 is Graduating grad school on Saturday....yikes!

    And I have a job interview on Friday afternoon which looks promising.

    t walgamuth
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    04 May 2012 11:03 AM
    Anybody able to offer a co-drive on sunday?
    t walgamuth
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    05 May 2012 07:52 PM

    Chris has kindly offered a codrive in the nutty 944!

    See you in the morning!

    t walgamuth
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    06 May 2012 11:21 PM

    Chris and I had a great time dualing in the red 944. He nipped me on the last run by some tenths of a second. the speedrome was an interesting place to run. It looked just like i imagined it would. Someone said they have been racing there for seventy years. It is a fifth mile track. A bit rough and slippery. The toilets flushed and had paper, soap and towells, and the concession stand had some pretty good hot dogs!

    It got really hot today.

    I think Chris is going to help me get the Ford back together. We're going to talk this week.

    nutty944
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    07 May 2012 07:49 AM
    Had fun running with you, Tom!!! Just wish the 944 would have liked the course as much as I did. I think even if we did get the tire pressures sorted out all the way we stil would have come up a little short on torque coming out of the turns.

    Once I get my schudule for the next week-ish figured out, I'll let you know and hopefully can help you out on the FF!
    nutty944
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    07 May 2012 08:39 PM
    We have the board meeting Thrusday night, then working on the EM build Friday and Saturday. Otherwise pretty free to lend a hand. I typically get out of work between 5 and 5:30. Let me know if I can lend a hand. I could probably attack the miata transmission on Sunday as well. Just let me know!
    t walgamuth
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    08 May 2012 07:26 AM

    Chris, please give me a call. 490 0275.

    Sounds good!

    t walgamuth
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    15 May 2012 06:40 AM

    after working days and nights on a paying job last two weeks ai am thrashing now toget the reynard back together last night prepared to install the head and am pondering whether to use any material on the head gasket.

    i got the battery secured in its new location. i dropped the body panels off at the body shop yesterday for paint too.

    thrashing to be ready to run on sunday.

    t walgamuth
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    16 May 2012 09:18 PM

    Got the head on, torqued down, installed studs for the rocker shaft, and adjusted the valves. Got the valve cover on and the t stat sitting in its housing. Had a million distractions today.

    Chris, did I give you the amount of money I said? Please give me a call when you can.

    nutty944
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    16 May 2012 09:23 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    Got the head on, torqued down, installed studs for the rocker shaft, and adjusted the valves. Got the valve cover on and the t stat sitting in its housing. Had a million distractions today.

    Chris, did I give you the amount of money I said? Please give me a call when you can.

    At the rate you're going we'll have it easy Friday and Saturday!

    I'm just getting home now, I'll give you a call on my lunch break tomorrow.

    t walgamuth
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    18 May 2012 11:11 PM

    I got the exhaust header installed tonight. I had to remove all the studs i installed for the exhaust header because with the frame rail right there I could not get the header on.

    chris worked on the rear suspension. Tomorrow we need to finish some work on the front suspension, install the body work that we can get from the shop, load the car onto the trailer. Fill the oil and coolant, time the engine and start it.

    No worries.

    Yikes!

    lharts
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    19 May 2012 08:44 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I got the exhaust header installed tonight. I had to remove all the studs i installed for the exhaust header because with the frame rail right there I could not get the header on.

    chris worked on the rear suspension. Tomorrow we need to finish some work on the front suspension, install the body work that we can get from the shop, load the car onto the trailer. Fill the oil and coolant, time the engine and start it.

    No worries.

    Yikes!

    we got eight entered so far , second largest class, you had better be their !!!!!!!!

    t walgamuth
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    20 May 2012 04:52 AM
    As of last night I had decided not to come. I am not sure of the timing and there may have been a noise in the engine. I am better rested now so may come on over.
    t walgamuth
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    20 May 2012 04:55 AM

    and use it as a test and tune.

    We had some problems yesgterday, thrashing to get it all back together, mostly due to poor choices on my part, but I think I am going to run on over. I will disappoint Mark though because the body shop only got the nose and cowl done and the car will be seriously not pretty.;)

    t walgamuth
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    20 May 2012 07:51 PM

    So the car ran pretty well but tech revealed a loose right rear bearing or hub. I tried tightening the big cap screw but could not improve anything. We'll have to pull it apart again.

    Drat!

    nutty944
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    20 May 2012 09:07 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    So the car ran pretty well but tech revealed a loose right rear bearing or hub. I tried tightening the big cap screw but could not improve anything. We'll have to pull it apart again.

    Drat!

    Should have said something, would have been glad to take a gander to see if we could figure it out. Let me know if you'll want a hand.

    t walgamuth
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    21 May 2012 05:20 AM
    How did the C mod battle go?
    Locked
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    21 May 2012 01:30 PM
    Lavender got his 1st win in the 'ol Dulon. Followed by don, then me, then Ray then.... (not sure where larry, mark, pruett, and crystal ended)
    t walgamuth
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    21 May 2012 02:15 PM

    I will miss our next point event too for family events but intend to be ready including some fairly decent hoosier tires next time I show up. What is up with Geoff?

    Sorry I missed even watching. It must have been a ding dong battle!

    t walgamuth
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    22 May 2012 08:42 AM
    Chris came over last night and we pulled the rr apart. It sure looks as if my brand new wheel bearing has gone all wobbly. He is going to press it out today and we will have a better look.
    t walgamuth
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    22 May 2012 10:30 PM
    So I'll have to try to return it and get a new one from the fellow I bought it from.
    Don Elzinga
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    22 May 2012 10:53 PM
    t walgamuth wrote:
    So I'll have to try to return it and get a new one from the fellow I bought it from.

    The bearing will be wobbly until the hub is tightened through it. The inner races are two separate pieces that need the hub to hold them together. If it's still wobbly with the hub tight, then it's a bad bearing.

    Don

    nutty944
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    23 May 2012 07:41 AM
    Was deffinitely bad bearing. The inner races were fully seated.
    hhammerly
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    23 May 2012 06:10 PM

    It is easy to damage a new bearring when pressing it in the hub, I use the old bearring outer race to press the new bearring on the upright first, without loading the inner race, I then press the hub on to the hub-bearring assy while supporting the inner race . Hope that this tip helps, good luck

    t walgamuth
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    24 May 2012 06:22 AM
    I called Larry Oliver and he is sending a new bearing no charge. You cannot do any better than that!
    Dick Rasmussen
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    24 May 2012 05:55 PM
    Tom,

    Is this a one piece bearing assembly?

    Is your upright Aluminum?

    If so many, including my Van Diemen, require the upright to be heated with a torch (propane torch worked for me) or hot oven to "spit sizzles" temp. The bearing meanwhile has been in a freezer for overnight after applying a thin coat of copaslip, etc. Then quickly drop the frozen bearing into the HOT upright (keeping the bearing as square in the upright bore as possible without burning your fingers). Then quickly carefully tap the assembly as needed to seat the assembly completely.


    FYI I have not done this since about 1993 so anyone who spots errors in my description please feel free to "refresh my memory".

    Dick
    t walgamuth
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    25 May 2012 08:23 AM

    I was planning to just have it pressed in. That is acceptable practice too, right?

    Yes, one piece bearing and aluminum upright.

    Thanks Dick!

    nutty944
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    25 May 2012 10:00 AM
    t walgamuth wrote:

    I was planning to just have it pressed in.  That is acceptable practice too, right? 

     

    Yes, one piece bearing and aluminum upright.

    Thanks Dick!

     

    I planned on chilling the bearing and warming the hub on it when pressing in. We have an oven type deal that will heat the hub without overheating. We use it for bearing and race installation pretty regularly. I've gotten to where that is standard procedure for bearng and race installation.
    Dick Rasmussen