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Last Post 24 Jun 2009 10:12 AM by  OneEyeMedia
Where do I send the repair bill for my vandalism?
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Bobzilla
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21 Jun 2009 01:55 PM

    Just wanting to know who is going to pay my repair bill for your Tech "person" ripping out my battery from it factory tray and hold down and pulling wires out of the fuse box. Instead of pass/fail and explaining apparently it's OK for Ft Wayne tech inspectors to rip apart peoples cars to prove they are "right". Also would like to know how you expect me to make up a father's day gift that included his first auto-x (that he's been excited about doing for the last 2 weeks) and causing me to push my own car back to paddock after you vandalized it in front of me.

    The extremely long line to check in (45 minute wait time, arrived at 8am, finally got checked in at 8:45) was bad, but the rude, inconsiderate vandal that apparently feels it's OK to destroy someone elses car is inexcusable. The same car that had been run competitively the last 2 full seasons, that had been inspected multiple times in its CURRENT condition (Verizon, Grissom, Kruse) and had just transported it's 3 occupants 150 miles without a hiccup. Teh same car that sees 300+ miles every week, and is taking us to visit family in Florida in less than a week. This is the car you decide to "prove a point".

    So, who do I send my bill for the permanent repair? Our shop rate is $95/hr, 1 hour of diag, .2 of repair time and $6 in supplies. THat comes to $120 + Marion county sales tax of $8.40 comes to a grand total of $128.40. Who's paying? Don't worry, this won't happen again because you will never find me at a Ft Wayne region sponsored event again. There's too many regions looking for participants within 2 hours of me, I don't have to drive up to you to spend my hard earned money.

    mavisky
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    21 Jun 2009 06:55 PM
    Wow, damn. Guess maybe I should come back to doing Tech at these events after all. I assumed they could handle it without me around this year since I wasn't racing. Guess I was wrong. Sorry to hear you had to go through this Bob.
    RonConrad
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    21 Jun 2009 07:23 PM
    Sorry to hear that Bob. Was there a question of legality of your car, or just a loose battery? You may want to email the RE or the Solo Chair.
    skillet
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    21 Jun 2009 07:24 PM
    Not to add fuel to an already hot fire, but what specifically was the reason for the removal of the battery? How does the removal of a battery destroy wire/etc...? I'm seriously being inquisitive. Did they not undo the terminals? Please explain a little more in depth. Sorry for the bad taste thats been left in your mouth.
    wrheadle
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    22 Jun 2009 04:01 AM

    This has been forwarded to the Fort Wayne Region Board of Directors. I appologize for your unpleasant experience.

    Bill Headlee

    FWR Director @ Large

    Bobzilla
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    22 Jun 2009 05:52 AM

    skillet wrote:
    Not to add fuel to an already hot fire, but what specifically was the reason for the removal of the battery? How does the removal of a battery destroy wire/etc...? I'm seriously being inquisitive. Did they not undo the terminals? Please explain a little more in depth. Sorry for the bad taste thats been left in your mouth.

    The battery was not removed. It was forced out of the factory holddown it's sat in for the last several years. He put his body weight behind a hard tug and forced it out of the plastic tray. He pulled with enough force to pull it up, out and allowed it to drop into the engine compartment to prove it could come out. Almost all new vehicles use plastic trays and if you pull hard enough, any will come out. His job is NOT to "prove his point" but to make an inspection and pass or fail a vehicle based on that inspection. Had he just left it at "It moves, so I would like to see it more secure. It's all about safety, you know?" I wouldhave source some bungees to make him feel at ease. But to make up that I have a broken tray, or twisted holddowns and then to forcibly rip it out of the car and allow it to dangle off the wires is uncalled for. Batteries are heavy, and the wiring on mst imports is small. Let a 45lb battery dangle off the wires and things get pulled apart.

    skillet
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    22 Jun 2009 06:18 AM
    Ah, I understand now.
    OneEyeMedia
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    22 Jun 2009 09:50 AM

    FAIL...

    Bob, Travis and I wondered where the heck you went. This is very unfortant. Especially since FWR has many other issues with in its club. I would believe Steve K will be in touch very qucikly with you. I would HOPE FWR takes reasponsibility and pays the debt owed.

    I can vouch for Bob, this guy has raced this Elantra for three yrs now. Has been to multiple FWR events under same condition. I have heard this battery issue bs many times from past events/schools. Lets put a strap on it thing. Sometimes SAFETY can be taken too far, this is a certain case for sure. There is no reason to destroy a persons car, no reason at all.

    Bob, correct me if I am wrong, but you work TECH in the Indy region right? Your usual position for the club, right?

    Dude, I wish you the best of luck with this and really hope it works out better. I wish I could say sorry we will not see you at another FWR event, but I would never come back again either if this happen to me.

    See you around bro and take care!

    Also, why do auto manufacture pay high skilled engineers to design devices to hold these batteries down? Really, if it looks like it was never tampered with, leave it alone!

    KBroeker
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    22 Jun 2009 10:47 AM

    Wow! I wish I had known about this when it happened. And I wish this incident never happened.

    Let me say that what I have to say here is my voice as a conscientious club member and not "the voice of the club".

    First, let me say, Bob, I don't know that we have met, but I do know Jason and if says you are a decent guy, I have to believe him. I am sorry you had this happen. From what you said, it seems that you had not altered the way your battery was mounted from the factory, do I have that right?

    Second, let me say to both Bob, and anyone else who is reading this, that the actions of one person should not define a club. This is why I said I wish I had known about this.

    You are right, the main point of Tech is safety. I am a Solo Safety Steward, although this was my first event of the year, so I might be a little rusty. I was not Cheif Safety Steward for the event and I actually had the assignment of working Grid, but when you are a SSS, you are not allowed to "take off your safety hat". I knew there were two other SSS there that are either FWR members or "regulars". What I found out during the time before the event is that there were several "visiting" SSS, including the divisional SSS, Mark Sommer (he was the one who caught that the course was too close to paddock and we had to move barrier cones to demark this). I found this out because I was wearing my actual Safety Stewards hat early in the event because one of the other SSS asked me to do a "safety course walk" with him (the hat is flourescent green; I am about 6'2", middle aged with a middle aged gut, was wearing khaki shorts with a black t-shirt with a tribal "Man in the Maze" symbol on it) and I kept getting hit up about safety issues. My point is this; if I had known or if you had gone to other SSS or other event organizers to protest what had gone on in Tech, I hope you would have had an audience. I am sure it would not have been pleasant to second guess a guy who was doing a job he volunteered for, but to me, next to safety, the most important thing is that all have a good experience at one of our events.

    By the way, some vehicles are specifically excluded (high CG is one reason). I know this because there was some concern that the Honda Fit that was running first heat in HS might be excluded because it looks high CG compared to the track. But it is specifically mentioned under HS, just as your Elantra (that is what I am seeing, isn't it) would fit under Hyundai NOC in HS, so there have not been any inherent flaws in design of the stock vehicle deemed by the Solo Event Board excluding it.

    In terms of if your mount was deemed to be correctible or if you needed help with the re-install after tech, generally club members are quick to help out people with mechanical issues. I remember helping a new guy install a new wheel stud at our school a few years ago because he had one that was sheared off and they would not let him pass tech with 4 out of 5 lugnuts on the one wheel. He went out and got the part and I helped him install it. As I was leaving Sunday, Andy Peppler and his dad were puting his "street" exhaust back on his Miata. I happened to have my tools and two jacks in the trunk (we would have had to find jack stands to be safe) and I offered my help and gear. I did this just cause I saw Andy under the back of the car. They did not ask and did not need my tools or help, but said thank you anyway.

    Anyway, as I said earlier, please do not judge the whole region based on the one experience. As Ron Conrad said, please try to work out this issue with Steve Kammeyer (the RE) or as Bill Headlee has already notified the board, await their response. I know that not too many of the board members participate on the Forum, but some do monitor it.

    Respectfully,

    Bobzilla
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    22 Jun 2009 12:56 PM
    JPMRacing26 wrote:

    FAIL...

    Bob, Travis and I wondered where the heck you went. This is very unfortant. Especially since FWR has many other issues with in its club. I would believe Steve K will be in touch very qucikly with you. I would HOPE FWR takes reasponsibility and pays the debt owed.

    I can vouch for Bob, this guy has raced this Elantra for three yrs now. Has been to multiple FWR events under same condition. I have heard this battery issue bs many times from past events/schools. Lets put a strap on it thing. Sometimes SAFETY can be taken too far, this is a certain case for sure. There is no reason to destroy a persons car, no reason at all.

    Bob, correct me if I am wrong, but you work TECH in the Indy region right? Your usual position for the club, right?

    Dude, I wish you the best of luck with this and really hope it works out better. I wish I could say sorry we will not see you at another FWR event, but I would never come back again either if this happen to me.

    See you around bro and take care!

    Also, why do auto manufacture pay high skilled engineers to design devices to hold these batteries down? Really, if it looks like it was never tampered with, leave it alone!

    Thanks man. I was lookiong forward to hangin out with you guys as I haven't seen much of you this year! Too bad this happened. emails are being sent to the correct people. I needed to cool down before I even attempted to write a coherent, non-profanity laced email to anyone.

    Yes, I have been the Indy Region Tech chief for the last 2 years. There are proper ways to approach situations such as this, and none were used. You do not try to break someone's car to make your point. Ever. You pass, or you fail.

    wrheadle
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    22 Jun 2009 07:32 PM

    I would request that this discussion pause while thing get sorted out. Right now only one side of the story is presented. Others exist as they always do. Please be patient. This incident will be reviewed and handled appropriately.

    Bill Headlee

    FWR Director @ Large

    bmonnin1
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    23 Jun 2009 08:05 AM
    wrheadle wrote:

    I would request that this discussion pause while thing get sorted out. Right now only one side of the story is presented. Others exist as they always do. Please be patient. This incident will be reviewed and handled appropriately.

    Bill Headlee

    FWR Director @ Large

    I agree with Bill. Let us not make any judgments before both sides of the story are told. Please remember that we are a volunteer organization and I am sure the tech was well meaning. Let us not slander the good name of the tech whom was just trying to do the job he was assigned to do and may or may not have made a mistake, after all we all make mistakes, right. Let the board investigate the incident and if a mistake was made I am sure the board will see that the situation is rectified as best as possible

    GChambers
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    23 Jun 2009 08:41 AM
    bmonnin1 wrote:
    wrheadle wrote:

    I would request that this discussion pause while thing get sorted out. Right now only one side of the story is presented. Others exist as they always do. Please be patient. This incident will be reviewed and handled appropriately.

    Bill Headlee

    FWR Director @ Large

    I agree with Bill. Let us not make any judgments before both sides of the story are told. Please remember that we are a volunteer organization and I am sure the tech was well meaning. Let us not slander the good name of the tech whom was just trying to do the job he was assigned to do and may or may not have made a mistake, after all we all make mistakes, right. Let the board investigate the incident and if a mistake was made I am sure the board will see that the situation is rectified as best as possible

    Both sides of the story? I'd love to hear this one.... Seems to me that a Tech guy ripping a battery out of a competitors car is just plain wrong whatever the "other side of the story" is. You just don't do that! How hard is that to understand?

    Edit: BTW, did I mention how much fun the course was to drive? Also, it was great to see my Ft. Wayne region friends again too.

    bmonnin1
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    23 Jun 2009 11:09 AM
    GChambers wrote:
    bmonnin1 wrote:
    wrheadle wrote:

    I would request that this discussion pause while thing get sorted out. Right now only one side of the story is presented. Others exist as they always do. Please be patient. This incident will be reviewed and handled appropriately.

    Bill Headlee

    FWR Director @ Large

    I agree with Bill. Let us not make any judgments before both sides of the story are told. Please remember that we are a volunteer organization and I am sure the tech was well meaning. Let us not slander the good name of the tech whom was just trying to do the job he was assigned to do and may or may not have made a mistake, after all we all make mistakes, right. Let the board investigate the incident and if a mistake was made I am sure the board will see that the situation is rectified as best as possible

    Both sides of the story? I'd love to hear this one.... Seems to me that a Tech guy ripping a battery out of a competitors car is just plain wrong whatever the "other side of the story" is. You just don't do that! How hard is that to understand?

    Edit: BTW, did I mention how much fun the course was to drive? Also, it was great to see my Ft. Wayne region friends again too.

    I never said it was right. I strongly believe that any justice system whether it be criminal, civil, or a local SCCA club should be based on the principle "innocent until proven guilty". Therefore before I judge someone I want to hear both sides of the story. For that matter Bob's side of the story (as posted so far on the forums) does not seem complete although I do not doubt what he has said so far. Besides an open forum is not the place for this discussion. The place for this discussion is at the Fort Wayne's board meeting were both sides of the story can be presented in a calm and cool manner and a fair and proper decision can be made. Please let the board members do their jobs.

    BTW: I had a lot of fun at the last Indy event in Grissom and look forward to the National tour at Grissom in a few weeks.

    The Nebulizer
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    23 Jun 2009 12:17 PM
    GChambers wrote:

    Both sides of the story? I'd love to hear this one....

    ... maybe Bob waited until this guy was hunched over his engine bay, then put it in reverse and floored it (the white piggy jumping back with a force it has held back all of these autocrosses). The Tech might have reached for the closest thing to catch his balance and grabbed the battery. Then as Bob continued to floor the Elantra, the battery being clutched in the tech's terrified hands ripped from the fuse box. The tech might have bounced his head against the hood, and while losing consciousness, dropped the battery on the radiator. [:P]

    Just kidding. Yeah, you have to hear both sides of the story, even if you believe the original and can't see any other possibility.

    BTW glad to see this apparently being handled well by FW.

    wrheadle
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    23 Jun 2009 02:13 PM

    GChambers wrote:

    Both sides of the story? I'd love to hear this one.... Seems to me that a Tech guy ripping a battery out of a competitors car is just plain wrong whatever the "other side of the story" is. You just don't do that! How hard is that to understand?

    Edit: BTW, did I mention how much fun the course was to drive? Also, it was great to see my Ft. Wayne region friends again too.

    I didn't say anyone was right or wrong, I just asked for patience while it is dealt with. Please be patient until this is resolved.

    Bill

    GChambers
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    23 Jun 2009 06:54 PM
    wrheadle wrote:

    GChambers wrote:

    Both sides of the story? I'd love to hear this one.... Seems to me that a Tech guy ripping a battery out of a competitors car is just plain wrong whatever the "other side of the story" is. You just don't do that! How hard is that to understand?

    Edit: BTW, did I mention how much fun the course was to drive? Also, it was great to see my Ft. Wayne region friends again too.

    I didn't say anyone was right or wrong, I just asked for patience while it is dealt with. Please be patient until this is resolved.

    Bill

    Sure, Bill. I appologize.

    Bobzilla
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    24 Jun 2009 10:01 AM

    This has been (and continues to be) handled by the FWR. That is all I could ask for.

    As far as I'm concerned this matter is over, thread can be closed/deleted as deemed appropriate.

    OneEyeMedia
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    24 Jun 2009 10:12 AM
    Bobzilla wrote:

    This has been (and continues to be) handled by the FWR. That is all I could ask for.

    As far as I'm concerned this matter is over, thread can be closed/deleted as deemed appropriate.

    Our region does not have a moderator for these forums (last I knew) I would not like to see it deleted, would prefer it to be closed, but who am I :P

    You are not authorized to post a reply.


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