SPS 468x60 Banner
PrevPrev Go to previous topic
NextNext Go to next topic
Last Post 17 Jul 2015 04:56 PM by  djm1968
Cayman S setup
 62 Replies
Sort:
You are not authorized to post a reply.
Page 1 of 41234 > >>
Author Messages
klie5111
New Member
New Member
Posts:9


--
10 Nov 2009 08:15 PM

    So thinking about buying and setting up a cayman s for AS. What should I be looking for option wise? PSM, sport chrono package, etc? What other goodies would I need to buy (sways, struts)?

    Obviously needs to be pre 2009, but needing to know what else to start the search.

    00R101
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:


    --
    11 Nov 2009 05:17 AM

    Lots of people get PSM (Porsche Stbility Management) and PASM (Porsche Active Suspension Management) confused but they are very different. PSM was standard on all 987 Cayman and Boxsters (2005+). PASM was a $2K option and fairly rare.

    PSM is defeatble and you want it off for all autocross except possibly in heavy rain where the stability control is just invasive enough to keep the car going in the direction you want if a spin starts. It will come on automatically if you go into heavy ABS. That sounds really bad but the saving grace is the Sport Chrono option. When you have that and it is in Sport mode than the disable PSM will only come on if both front wheels go heavily into ABS (that has only happened to me once in a full year of AX and it was because I was braking through a 50 foot puddle of 2" standing water).

    PASM gives you two things. 1) The spring perches are different and the car rides 10mm lower than a non-PASM car. 2) The shock tuning is really excellent - in soft you will have a smoother ride than stock but the computer will sense aggressive driving and stiffen shocks in turns. In the Sport setting the low speed rebound is really kicked up and the car turns in much better, has slightly less body roll and is much more responsive. There really aren't any aftermarket shocks that are factory sized and represent any improvement over factory so PASM is the way to go.

    Sport Chrono gives you the silly stop watch in the center of the dash but more importantly remaps the e-throttle for quicker tip-in and more deceleration on trailing throttle. Also it gives you a hard rev limiter at 7200 rather than the stock progressive rev limiter which slowly reduces power starting about 6700. And the aforementioned PSM partial defeat.

    So, if you can find one get a Cayman S with PASM and Sport Chrono at a minimum.

    Then there are the incredibly rare options - Sport Buckets and PCCB. The Sport Bucket is not the same as the rather common Sport Seats. The Sport Bucket is the same as in the 997 GT3. It has a carbon/fiberglass shell and weighs about 20lbs less than the stock seat. PCCB (Porsche Ceramic Composite Brakes) weigh 50% less than steel (probably a savings of 10+# per corner)

    You can't retrofit Sport Chrono or PASM - too many computer changes. It is probably possible to retrofit the Sport Buckets but buying them as new parts is going to set you back $6k and you probably can't find used ones. PCCB is probably a factory only effort as there are probably different parts throughout the brake system to accomadate them.

    SO the ideal Cayman S would have PASM, Sport Chrono, PCCB and Sport Buckets and nothing else. Wheel sizes don't matter as you will go with lighter aftermarkets (OZ Algherrita is currently the best light wheel value out there). The only other option is the factory 5mm spacers. This gives you 10mm extra track width before applying the 1/4" wheel offset allowance.

    Stay away from the Bose stereo and the PCM (navigation) as they add weight. Also stay away from any aero add ons as they add weight.

    Other options - there was a factory short shifter but its probably not needed as the stock shifter is fine for 1-2 and 2-1 (you probably won't need 3rd at an SCCA legal AX as even with lower profile R tires you are probably good to 68mph in 2nd.)

    After you get the car go buy a GT3 front sway and Tarret end links (or talk to Greg Fordahl who also has a good front sway setup). The heavier front bar gives you adjustability and helps settle the non-limited slip rear end while reducing body roll. I found that on my base Boxster I would vary the bar from mid stiff to full soft depending on grip level.

    Alignment - as much negative camber as you can get in the front and as little as you can get in the rear. A little toe out in front and rear toe near zero (season to taste).

    00R101
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:


    --
    11 Nov 2009 05:31 AM

    Wow - and here's the car you want on autotrader -

    http://www.autotrader.com/fyc/vdp.j...dard=false

    If the link doesn't work I searched for Cayman S and keyword PCCB. For $39K its an ok deal. There are some options like full leather and PCM that add weight but you probably won't find another with PCCBs for a long time.

    NJGT3
    Basic Member
    Basic Member
    Posts:316


    --
    11 Nov 2009 02:01 PM

    Alan's information is on the spot. Great information.

    Cayman Spring Rates:

    Standard: F:154# R:228# (dampers ride stiffer for street use than PASM soft, and too low compression for autoX, decent rebound)

    PASM: F:174# R:297# (the main reason to choose PASM)

    2006 cars are prone to engine failures, several issues reported, these cars are close to get out of warranty, so shop for 2006 with extended Porsche warranty or 2007-2008 cars.

    In 2008 there were two options, the Design Edition and the Sport Edition. The Cayman S Sport Edition, had the 10mm lower sport PASM (20mm lower than stock and 10mm lower than standard PASM). I don't have the spring rates for this version, but it is stiffer. It also got 303Hp instead of 295Hp.

    A common and A-Stock illegal modification is the snorkel delete.

    Ideal car: 2008 Cayman S Sport with PCCB, Carbon seats, sport chrono, that's it. Expect to pay around $70k for such car (used), and I doubt there is one in the entire U.S matching these specs.

    Down to Earth car: 2006 Cayman S with high miles (40k miles or more), CPO, PASM, Sport chrono, that's it. Expect to pay low to mid 30s for such car.

    PCCB cars carry a premium and sell quickly, almost impossible to find. Keep in mind that a brand new Cayman S + PCCB touches 911 Carrera prices, so people preferred to buy a Carrera, very few Cayman S with PCCB in U.S. The Carbon seats (introduced with the 2008 GT2) became an option in 2008, so retrofitting them to a 2006 Cayman will take almost $7,000. To retrofit the PCCB, you need new calipers, rotors, bolts and brackets, cost around $16k. PASM is virtually impossible to retrofit, sensors, dashboard, buttons, shocks, springs, hats, mounts, wiring, control module, let alone $$$.

    The car is geared tall, 74mph in 2nd gear, and power doesn't come nicely until 4,000 rpm, so run a short rear tire (285/30), and the widest front tire possible (255/30) on the 8"/9" x 18" wheels. My 07 Cayman S feels extremely underpowered, it feels barely faster than my 2003 Celica GT-S.

    The PASM cars suffer from inside rear wheel spin much more than the stock suspension cars. I have driven both (and Boxsters and the 2nd generation cars).

    The 997 GT3 Cup front bar (blade style), the Tarret blade style bar (call Ira and tell him Rad recommended the bar) both are stiffer than the 997 GT3 and 997 GT2 front sway bars. The H&R bar is not adjustable, and softer than the street 997 GT3/GT3 RS bar. Run as much bar as possible, because the inside rear wheel spin is annoying (especially with PASM and even more with sticky tires).

    With the right wheels, exhaust changes, and right options, the car can hit the scales with 2 gallons of fuel under 2,830 lbs, but this is a $80k car due to the cost of Magnesium wheels and the ideal Cayman S Sport. We have yet to see how the Cayman does against a well prepared 996 40th Anniversary (3.6, 345Hp, LSD and pretty light)
    klie5111
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:9


    --
    12 Nov 2009 12:50 PM

    Thanks for the great info. When you mention a "well prepared 996 40th anniversary" what would need to be done to prepare that car? It sounds like the prep on a Cayman is pretty minimal, is that true with the 911 as well?

    meckert
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:51


    --
    28 Nov 2009 08:51 AM

    Great feedback!!! Just a couple questions???

    1st Q may need to be send to SAC, but thought I'd throw it out here for discussion. The Sport Editions came with 19" rims as only option, correct? If so, then 19" would need to be run?

    NJGT3 wrote:

    Down to Earth car: 2006 Cayman S with high miles (40k miles or more), CPO, PASM, Sport chrono, that's it. Expect to pay low to mid 30s for such car.

    PCCB cars carry a premium and sell quickly, almost impossible to find. Keep in mind that a brand new Cayman S + PCCB touches 911 Carrera prices, so people preferred to buy a Carrera, very few Cayman S with PCCB in U.S. The Carbon seats (introduced with the 2008 GT2) became an option in 2008, so retrofitting them to a 2006 Cayman will take almost $7,000. To retrofit the PCCB, you need new calipers, rotors, bolts and brackets, cost around $16k. PASM is virtually impossible to retrofit, sensors, dashboard, buttons, shocks, springs, hats, mounts, wiring, control module, let alone $$$.

    I may be off-base, but I didn't think we could update/backdate different parts for different years in stock... so putting +08 seats in an 06-07 is not allowed in stock classes?

    [quote] With the right wheels, exhaust changes, and right options, the car can hit the scales with 2 gallons of fuel under 2,830 lbs, but this is a $80k car due to the cost of Magnesium wheels and the ideal Cayman S Sport. We have yet to see how the Cayman does against a well prepared 996 40th Anniversary (3.6, 345Hp, LSD and pretty light)

    What exhaust changes have you tried? It would have to be downstream from the 2nd cat on each side, correct? If one were to run some sort of "straight pipes" after the 2nd cats, do you deal with any loss of backpressure? I can PM if need to take it offline.

    Thanks for any feedback - just trying to do my homework before I start diving into a project. Cheers!


    AbePotter
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:


    --
    30 Nov 2009 07:33 AM

    I've looked at these same questions with Annie's Green S Sport.

    We are stuck with 19" wheels. There is no legal way to stick 18s on it, IMHO.

    I don't think the exhaust can be touched either. Why? Because the second catalysts are PART OF the big muffler, Just like the 911 Turbo and other newer Porsches. Unless it becomes Stock legal to chop the rear housing off any catalytic converter, a lot of stock Porsches will need stock mufflers.

    Abe

    EBacon
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:25


    --
    30 Nov 2009 11:48 PM

    Firstly, thanks for the great info in this thread so far! I'm hoping to procure myself a sweet AS ride for 2010 but a 2006-2007 Cayman S with PASM is proving damn hard to find.

    What would folks here recommend in aftermarket shocks to at least approach the performance of this rare factory option? (I keep re-reading the Stock category rules but not being particularly well-versed in the mechanical details I am having trouble understanding what's allowed.) Are Bilstein PSS10's the shite for the Cayman S like they are for the 993? Or maybe it's Penske double-adjustables like Ken Motonishi had in the Miata I bought from him in 2004? [:)]

    Cheers,
    Liz

    NJGT3
    Basic Member
    Basic Member
    Posts:316


    --
    01 Dec 2009 04:51 PM

    Some more information...

    - Only the 2008 Cayman S can use the optional GT2 seats. I had these seats in my former GT3 RS, they are 30 lbs lighter than the standard Cayman seats and 34 lbs lighter than the standard GT3/GT3 RS seats. So, if you are running a 2006 (I will avoid) or 2007 Cayman S, you need to run the standard seats (lightest from the three options in 2006/2007).

    - Abe is right on the restriction for 19" wheels for the Cayman S Sport. The car was not offered with 18" wheels as option, only 19". My Cayman S has 19" wheels, and I ran 265/295 A6 on the stock 8"/9.5" wheels. The Cayman S Sport had the option for Carrera Sport wheels, which are a little wider 8.5"/10" x 19". I needed 10mm of spacers over the stock front 8" x 19" to avoid rubbing the 265 tire with the upper hat on the stock front strut. 5mm spacers are a factory option, so you can go up down to -11mm offset compared to stock wheels. The downside with 19" is the tall gearing.

    - I don't know of any aftermarket company offering shocks for the stock struts in the Cayman S. What I know is that the car without PASM is less prone to inside rear wheel spin in corner exit, but I would rather buy a PASM equipped car and put a stiffer front bar. My stock shocks are pretty good at autoX, the springs are just too soft for A6, but they are ok for street tires.

    - Bilstein PSS10, PSS9, B16 Damptonics are not legal for A-Stock, because they use different springs. The Damptronics are not legal in any class, as they are electronic controlled aftermarket shocks (active suspension).

    It is very difficult to find a Cayman S with PCCB, and much more a PCCB/PASM/SportChrono car, and even more a 2008. However, even the base Cayman S without these options is a very capable car at autoX, and with the Z06/GT3/Elise away, it is a better battle against the C5 Vette, RX7-R1 and BMW MCoupe.

    Orthonormal
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:


    --
    01 Dec 2009 05:18 PM

    If you can install a stock-shaped spring seat on the Bilstein PSS10 and adapt it to use the stock upper mounting plate, then you can mount the stock springs on them and be legal for Stock.

    EBacon
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:25


    --
    01 Dec 2009 11:11 PM

    I found a 2006 Cayman S with PCCB, PASM, Sport Chrono. It's still available on PCA Mart if you want it, but although it's loaded & lovely, do be forewarned that it also has some minor rear-end damage that wasn't properly repainted. I had to walk away. Also, does everybody realize that replacing a carbon-ceramic rotor costs $4250 EACH in parts (and that's not including $375 ea for the pads)? I'm not going there, my friends. Not this year anyways. [:P]

    What about Moton shocks?

    meckert
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:51


    --
    04 Dec 2009 08:20 AM

    Abe --

    Looking at a cutaway of the exhaust, the "muffler" component is actually a separate piece banded around an enclosed cat... I would think you could do mods downstream of the enclosed cat (now if it's worth it, that's another question). But that's my interpretation, so best thing to do would be to get a ruling on it before spending time heading down this route.

    NJGT3
    Basic Member
    Basic Member
    Posts:316


    --
    07 Dec 2009 10:36 PM

    I think 13.10.E covers that modification, but a clarification would be recommended.

    E. Any part of the exhaust system beyond (downstream from) the
    header/manifold or catalytic converter, if so equipped, may be
    substituted or removed provided the system meets the requirements
    of 3.5 and 3.3.3.B.15. Stainless steel heat exchangers are
    permitted only if the physical dimensions and configuration
    remain unchanged.

    Removal of a portion of the stock exhaust can be considered a
    substitution. The resulting cat-back exhaust system is not required
    to exit in the stock location. However, the requirements
    of section 3.3.3.B.15, and 3.5 must still be met.

    Anyway, with the incoming "I can hear tires chirping from my backyard, it is so loud" sound policies, and a stock exhaust producing a vacuum machine like sound that gets close to triple digit dB, doubtfully I would do anything to a Cayman exhaust.

    On a different topic, despite of the low front camber numbers we can get from a stock Cayman (0.5-0.7 degrees), the car shows more wear in the inside edges of the front tires. Caster is so good, that the car doesn't need to use crazy negative camber values.

    EBacon
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:25


    --
    11 Dec 2009 03:02 PM
    I bought a Cayman S this week! PASM, Sport Chrono. Can't wait for it to get shipped out from Chicago; should be to me on Dec 22nd. Best Xmas present EVAH, seeing as I've waited 27 years to fulfill my dream to drive a Porsche someday. [:D] Now I'm shopping for wheels, tires (plus a roof rack!) and front sway bar to start with for 2010. Look forward to talking more about this fine machine!
    NJGT3
    Basic Member
    Basic Member
    Posts:316


    --
    11 Dec 2009 10:07 PM

    Congratulations Liz!!

    It is a very nice car. For wheels, I got the 18x8 and 18x9 OZ sold by TireRack, they are affordable and light. Front ones 17.3 lbs and rear ones 18.8 lbs. Tires depend on your intended use and choice, RA1, XS, R6, A6, V710, RE-11, Z1, etc.

    EBacon
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:25


    --
    05 Jan 2010 03:00 PM

    Hey folks,

    I'm having trouble determining the 2006 Cayman S stock wheel size for 18" rims. Is it 8" front or 8.5" front, and 9" rear or 10" rear, or something else entirely? :) Also, are wheel spacers legal in stock (there's a 5mm one available from the factory so I'd presume so) & when do they become necessary? Thanks very much for your help!


    Cheers,
    Liz

    meckert
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:51


    --
    05 Jan 2010 06:42 PM

    Hi Liz -

    The 2006 stock 18" rims are: 18x8 front 57mm offset & 18x9 rear 43mm offset (option 397). There's also a factory 5mm spacer option (XRP). In addition, you also have the +/- 1/4in variance allowed in stock, so this gives you a fair amount of options when it comes to what you want to do with spacers.

    EBacon
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:25


    --
    15 Mar 2010 11:50 PM

    So how's everybody's Cayman S setup going? I just ran my first autox in my 2006 Cayman S with the PCA club here in Portland, Oregon. A-M-A-Z-I-N-G!! I've really done almost nothing except replace the stock 19" wheels with 18" lightweight wheels (the popular OZ Allegherita) and put in a CG Lock. Because of threatened rain (and yes, a desire to experience the car in its bone stock trappings) I ran on my PS2 street tires — and because my tire pressure gauge was malfunctioning my tires were actually underinflated — but it was still A-W-E-S-O-M-E to drive.

    I'm thinking about putting in a front sway bar later this season based on folks' advice, plus I think I'm going to get the hidden hitch to pull a tire trailer, too, but that can wait. All I know is that we is going to have some good times in AS this year!

    Love to hear more reports from around the country....

    Cheers,

    Liz

    00R101
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:


    --
    20 Mar 2010 05:08 AM

    Liz,

    Congrats on the Cayman S. Glad you are enjoying it. I think the Tarrett front sway is really the only way to go. It's a kit that's made up of the GT3 5 point adjustable sway and their well-engineered endlinks. Fits like a glove but is a pain to install because tthe 987 sway fits above the front subframe. You have to drop the subframe to get the old bar out and put the new one in. On 986s they had little subframe connector bars at the front and by loosening them you could get the bar out. Not so in the 987. So I recommend doing on a lift where you can get some room to wirk. Nothing worse than trying to support the whole subfame on your chest while lying under the car :-)

    Also, the hitch to get is the WillWood Systems hidden hitch. Since I have switched to pulling the car on an open trailer, I have no use for mine. I would consider selling it or parts of it. The ball mount and ball are readily accessible but I will have to pull the bumper off to get at the receiver and mounting plates. What I recommend is to give Will a call 209-772-3399 http://www.willwoodsystem.com/ and buy the Hidden hitch reciever mount and heavy duty bumper supports (required) then buy my ball mount.

    Good luck this season,

    Alan Pozner (alanpozner @ gmail . com)

    EBacon
    New Member
    New Member
    Posts:25


    --
    24 Jun 2010 10:19 PM

    Hiya folks,

    Anybody else developing a Cayman S? Well, that's probably an overstatement for my level of technical acumen, but part-way into the season now I'm thinking about a couple different things than I was before. (I did get the trailer hitch installed (thanks for your help, Alan!) and procured a wonderful South Sport tire trailer that pulls like a dream.) Principally, I'd like to install the factory short shifter and get an aluminum pedal set. Not really sure how I can do the latter within the rules but am starting to investigate. Tips??

    The sway bar seems pretty unimportant thus far; I'm not experiencing any inside rear wheel spin although I definitely have a ways to go to drive this amazing car to its maximum potential. Fun fun fun!!

    Cheers,
    Liz

    You are not authorized to post a reply.
    Page 1 of 41234 > >>


    Sunoco 88x31 Button
    Woodhouse Motorsports SPS 88x31 Button
    G-Loc Button Vorshlag 88x31 Button

    Advertise on SCCAForums.com and reach thousands of visitors per day!

    SafeRacer FREE SHIPPING over $99

    Shop for Pirelli tires at Tire Rack. blank



    Sunoco Bottom 468x60 Banner