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Last Post 21 May 2013 10:50 AM by  Frank05v
Who has tried the BFG R1-S in SP?
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GotCone?
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26 Apr 2013 02:17 PM
    So I'm in a bit of a dilemma and I'd love all feedback from those who have tried both.

    I'm co-driving in Street Prepared this season. The car owner has made the switch this season from the Kumhos to the Hoosiers. Our first event went well and out of the box no real changes were needed to make them 'work'. It's obvious the Hoosiers want more front camber, so we're dialing that in as well as a few other changes.

    I keep hearing a lot of talk that the BFGs... "have more grip" "wear better" "last longer" and "handle heat better" This almost sounds too good to be true.

    I would LOVE to hear some feedback from people who have tried them and came from Hoosier A6s. 

    There is no size limitations for us as we can get the same size in either tire. However, the BFGs are a little bit cheaper and if they truly offer the same performance and last longer it almost sounds like a no brainer.

    Thanks in advance for your time and feedback.

    ratt_finkel
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    26 Apr 2013 06:36 PM
    ACM
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    26 Apr 2013 07:19 PM
    We ran A6s and R1-Ss on the ESP Talon last year. On tarmac at 70-90*F the R1-S was noticeably better than the A6. We brought both sets to Lincoln planning to run A6 for the Pro and R1-S for Nats; Sam won the Pro on the A6s, so it's fair to say the car was doing well. We swapped to R1-S the next day and the car had ZERO grip, none - it was horrible. We swapped to A6s for day 2 and Sam was almost as fast as Mark, and that was with screwed up damper settings, because I...screwed up.

    That was our experience last year. Rumour has it that BFG have reformulated the S compound and fixed the high heat problems, at the expense of cooler grip. Hopefully someone (else) will test this out !
    conekiller2
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    29 Apr 2013 09:37 AM
    There are several factors to consider. Er have not used Hoosiers on our car but can give a lot of feedback on the bfg. Here are the things to be aware of when using the Bfg r1s

    1. They love heat and it is very difficult to over heat them.
    2. They are optimal with ambient temps above 65-70 degrees with hot ground temps
    3. They have no grip in colder temps as we found out in new jersey at the pro. Ambient temps were 50-58 degrees on Saturday and 37-45 degrees on Sunday.
    4. They must be scrubbed in before they come to life. They have absolutely no grip when new/sticker. Either put a couple runs on them in a test course and let them heat cycle or take them for a drive and get them up to temp and let them heat cycle
    5. They rarely overheat or require cooling.
    Since we switched we have rarely used our sprayer and that is in south Florida weather typically 80-100 degrees with two drivers and usually about 5-6 runs each driver on a 40-65 sec course

    This is on a bsp s2000 using 275/35/18 on 18x11 wheels

    Sent from my SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2
    CHRISFP78
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    29 Apr 2013 12:43 PM
    Posted By conekiller2 on 29 Apr 2013 09:37 AM
    There are several factors to consider. Er have not used Hoosiers on our car but can give a lot of feedback on the bfg. Here are the things to be aware of when using the Bfg r1s

    1. They love heat and it is very difficult to over heat them.
    2. They are optimal with ambient temps above 65-70 degrees with hot ground temps
    3. They have no grip in colder temps as we found out in new jersey at the pro. Ambient temps were 50-58 degrees on Saturday and 37-45 degrees on Sunday.
    4. They must be scrubbed in before they come to life. They have absolutely no grip when new/sticker. Either put a couple runs on them in a test course and let them heat cycle or take them for a drive and get them up to temp and let them heat cycle
    5. They rarely overheat or require cooling.
    Since we switched we have rarely used our sprayer and that is in south Florida weather typically 80-100 degrees with two drivers and usually about 5-6 runs each driver on a 40-65 sec course

    This is on a bsp s2000 using 275/35/18 on 18x11 wheels

    Sent from my SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

    /\ /\

    What he said. I would also add that they are very tire pressure sensitive ( little lower pressure than hoosier is optimal) and that they go the fastest at higher slip angles than the Hoosier. I suspect that this is because they like heat. Coming from Hoosiers it has been hard for me to slide them  because when you drive the Hoosiers at a high slip angle they go away.

    I love the feel of the BFG. The footprint of the tire is more stable at the limit and gives great feed back. The Hoosier on the other hand feels mushy and vague at the limit.


    Frank05v
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    01 May 2013 11:12 AM
    I would love to try the BFGs but they aren't available in the size we need for our BSP car. Guess that takes a variable out for us though.
    mlane350z
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    01 May 2013 12:23 PM
    Posted By FrankL on 01 May 2013 11:12 AM
    I would love to try the BFGs but they aren't available in the size we need for our BSP car. Guess that takes a variable out for us though.

    This.
    GotCone?
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    07 May 2013 11:27 PM
    Posted By ratt_finkel on 26 Apr 2013 06:36 PM
    I have a thread going on here.

    http://forums.evolutionm.net/motor-...-tune.html

    Thanks Jeremy. A good data point there with some good info.


    ratt_finkel
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    08 May 2013 05:43 PM
    Posted By ACM on 26 Apr 2013 07:19 PM
    We ran A6s and R1-Ss on the ESP Talon last year. On tarmac at 70-90*F the R1-S was noticeably better than the A6. We brought both sets to Lincoln planning to run A6 for the Pro and R1-S for Nats; Sam won the Pro on the A6s, so it's fair to say the car was doing well. We swapped to R1-S the next day and the car had ZERO grip, none - it was horrible. We swapped to A6s for day 2 and Sam was almost as fast as Mark, and that was with screwed up damper settings, because I...screwed up.

    That was our experience last year. Rumour has it that BFG have reformulated the S compound and fixed the high heat problems, at the expense of cooler grip. Hopefully someone (else) will test this out !

    Based on my expienerece this seems counterproductive.  A6's are the only tire I know that work wonderfully out of the box in almost all weather conditions.  V710's and BFG's both require substantial heat to achive maximum grip.  And the BFG even more so.

    Which is great for a pro.  But horrible for a tour.  Besides their ability to take heat (I've had them up to 150F with IF pyro) but may require spraying in warmer weather.  They are not invulberanle to heat soak or over tempature conditions.

    I think they are a great pro tire, especially on abbrasive surfaces or for cars that are hard on tires.  They wear extremytl well.  But for hoosiers you just can't beat the "ready to go" status they provide.  I don't know abotu you, but I don't want to trhow away ANY runs at Nats.

    Also, ACM.  You mentioned you found the BFG's faster on Ashpualt.  Are you saying they are slower on concrete?

    PDM
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    15 May 2013 12:44 PM

    Conekiller - what were you using before for tires ?  Hoosiers ?  (curious what size you used to run and how they compared in width and height ?)

     

    Those that have switched, how do you find the accelleration (pro launching) and braking characteristics compared to Hoosiers ?

     Do they flatspot nearly as badly as Hoosiers if you screw up a brake point and smoke a tire ?

     How accurate is say Tire Rack's specs with respect to section width and tread width data ? (I have somewhat sensative limitations as to the tire profile as I specifically built my car around a certain Hoosier size.

    don

     

    ACM
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    17 May 2013 11:53 AM
    Posted By ratt_finkel on 08 May 2013 05:43 PM
    Posted By ACM on 26 Apr 2013 07:19 PM
    We ran A6s and R1-Ss on the ESP Talon last year. On tarmac at 70-90*F the R1-S was noticeably better than the A6. We brought both sets to Lincoln planning to run A6 for the Pro and R1-S for Nats; Sam won the Pro on the A6s, so it's fair to say the car was doing well. We swapped to R1-S the next day and the car had ZERO grip, none - it was horrible. We swapped to A6s for day 2 and Sam was almost as fast as Mark, and that was with screwed up damper settings, because I...screwed up.

    That was our experience last year. Rumour has it that BFG have reformulated the S compound and fixed the high heat problems, at the expense of cooler grip. Hopefully someone (else) will test this out !

    Based on my expienerece this seems counterproductive.  A6's are the only tire I know that work wonderfully out of the box in almost all weather conditions.  V710's and BFG's both require substantial heat to achive maximum grip.  And the BFG even more so.

    Which is great for a pro.  But horrible for a tour.  Besides their ability to take heat (I've had them up to 150F with IF pyro) but may require spraying in warmer weather.  They are not invulberanle to heat soak or over tempature conditions.

    I think they are a great pro tire, especially on abbrasive surfaces or for cars that are hard on tires.  They wear extremytl well.  But for hoosiers you just can't beat the "ready to go" status they provide.  I don't know abotu you, but I don't want to trhow away ANY runs at Nats.

    Also, ACM.  You mentioned you found the BFG's faster on Ashpualt.  Are you saying they are slower on concrete?

    Counterproductive or otherwise, that's what we found, and the R1-S needs no more heat than the A6 to reach grip levels beyond those of A6s.  There certainly could have been more grip available from the R1-S at even higher temperatures, we never went over the top temperature-wise.

    The only concrete we ran them on was at Lincoln - though there may have been a few hundred feet of concrete at Loring when we tested there. Either way, they were clearly faster than A6s on New England tarmac and at New England ambient temperatures, but they turned to total greaseballs at Lincoln;  when we tested the R1-S in New England the ambient temps were in the 80s, whereas the temperature at Lincoln was over 100*F most of the time iirc.


    ratt_finkel
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    17 May 2013 03:36 PM
    Posted By ACM on 17 May 2013 11:53 AM
    Counterproductive or otherwise, that's what we found, and the R1-S needs no more heat than the A6 to reach grip levels beyond those of A6s.  

     

    I'm sorry this made me 

    Everyone else I know that has tested these, not to mention the other 3 drivers that have ran my car all comment on the poor cold weather performance.  Maybe none of us know what we are talking about.  Take a look at the College Station Tour Results in ASP for good example 


    ratt_finkel
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    20 May 2013 01:14 PM
    Frank05v
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    20 May 2013 02:58 PM
    This reminds me quite a bit when I was drag racing when the drag radials became a big thing. Some guys made them work, some guys didn't and swore them off and went back to bias ply slicks. Car setups could change pretty drastically between two tires. ie: Pressures, springs, shocks, other suspension changes, converters, etc....

    That said, to simply throw BFGs on a car that is setup to run on Hoosiers is not necessarily a tell all about the potential of the BFG. I have no dog in this fight as said above, Hoosier is the only thing available in our sizes, but perhaps the car needs more setup around the BFG to be optimal.
    ratt_finkel
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    20 May 2013 04:26 PM
    Posted By FrankL on 20 May 2013 02:58 PM
    This reminds me quite a bit when I was drag racing when the drag radials became a big thing. Some guys made them work, some guys didn't and swore them off and went back to bias ply slicks. Car setups could change pretty drastically between two tires. ie: Pressures, springs, shocks, other suspension changes, converters, etc....

    That said, to simply throw BFGs on a car that is setup to run on Hoosiers is not necessarily a tell all about the potential of the BFG. I have no dog in this fight as said above, Hoosier is the only thing available in our sizes, but perhaps the car needs more setup around the BFG to be optimal.

    Frank, you are making the assumption my car WAS set up for the hoosiers


    Frank05v
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    21 May 2013 10:50 AM
    Posted By ratt_finkel on 20 May 2013 04:26 PM
    Posted By FrankL on 20 May 2013 02:58 PM
    This reminds me quite a bit when I was drag racing when the drag radials became a big thing. Some guys made them work, some guys didn't and swore them off and went back to bias ply slicks. Car setups could change pretty drastically between two tires. ie: Pressures, springs, shocks, other suspension changes, converters, etc....

    That said, to simply throw BFGs on a car that is setup to run on Hoosiers is not necessarily a tell all about the potential of the BFG. I have no dog in this fight as said above, Hoosier is the only thing available in our sizes, but perhaps the car needs more setup around the BFG to be optimal.

    Frank, you are making the assumption my car WAS set up for the hoosiers



    Fair enough.  lol

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