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Last Post 13 Apr 2015 11:22 PM by  lycanthrope
2015 Region Solo Class Structure
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Catch-22
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01 Apr 2015 09:38 AM

    For the 2015 season the Cincinnati Region will recognize the following classes as eligible to score points for year-end solo championship awards.  Event results will be handicapped using the current PAX Index.

    Street Open - All Street Classes

    SSR - SSR

    Street Touring Open - All Street Touring classes

    Street Prepared Open - All Street Prepared Classes

    Street Modified Open - Street Modified classes

    Prepared and Modified Open - All Prepared and Modified classes

    Novice - All classes with competitors in their first 3 events

    Ladies - All Ladies classes

    X - "Pro" class

     

    You may choose to compete in any class listed in the 2015 Solo rulebook instead of the above classes, BUT if you do not have a minimum of 3 entries at any given event you will not be eligible to score season championship points and that event will not be counted as an eligible event for season points.

    The minimum required events to be eligible for a season championship will be half the number of events held.  (so, if 10 events are held you will need to score points in 5 events to be championship eligible)

    Because this ruleset is being introduced after registration for PE1 opens, adjustments will be made at registration on site. 

    Thanks. 

    HotDoggin
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    01 Apr 2015 09:53 AM
    Awesome!

    This should hopefully have a secondary benefit of promoting attendance when class minimums are a concern-

    It's like real racing!!
    trippinbillies40
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    01 Apr 2015 11:08 AM

    Finally!!! Promoting what we're all here to do: compete!  The benefits of easier worker scheduling, heat organizing, fewer trophies to donate to single car classes... All awesome.  

    tacti
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    01 Apr 2015 11:15 AM
    this is just a thought...
    How do you think about changing the Indexed class from optional field to a required field, and add extra choice of "Running NON-Paxed Class" on MyAutoEvent registration page?
    In this way, everyone need to make a conscious choice of running non-pax class. right now, if they have attended previous event, it can automatically enter them to non-pax class.
    Catch-22
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    01 Apr 2015 04:53 PM
    APRIL FOOLS!!!

    Just kidding. We will actually be maintaining the status quo of offering 87 regular classes (true story. count 'em) and 10 index classes for a grand total of 97 classes.   That should easily cover our average entry level of about 75 per event.
    Hopefully everyone can be happy with that. Except of course the poor folks working T&S.
    trippinbillies40
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    01 Apr 2015 05:32 PM

    trippinbillies40
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    01 Apr 2015 05:35 PM

    On another note, if there really are people who will stop showing up to autocrosses because they wont get a trophy, I have to imagine that this count will be pretty low. So low in fact that I'm sure we could gang together here and donate back beer mugs to the cause so they can still get a participation trophy.  Thoughts?

    btschafer
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    01 Apr 2015 05:56 PM
    Posted By Catch-22 on 01 Apr 2015 04:53 PM
    APRIL FOOLS!!!

    Just kidding. We will actually be maintaining the status quo of offering 87 regular classes (true story. count 'em) and 10 index classes for a grand total of 97 classes.   That should easily cover our average entry level of about 75 per event.
    Hopefully everyone can be happy with that. Except of course the poor folks working T&S.

    Yep.  T&S needn't be nearly as difficult as it is.


    Catch-22
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    01 Apr 2015 08:36 PM
    Yeah. 87 classes is too many, but its not so bad when there are 1200 entries in Lincoln.

    At the regional level in most places you end up with more classes than entries, which is not exactly ideal.

    Sorry for the April Fools trick, but we really do have 97 classes and if we don't do something about it before PE1 we are stuck with it for another season. I think its in everyone's best interest if we do something, anything, to significantly cut that number.
    Catch-22
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    02 Apr 2015 08:21 AM
    I like the approach in post #1 the best as it has multiple upsides in making event management easier and promoting more (lots more) competition, but here are some further ideas...

    1. Remove all indexed classes except Novice and Ladies. "Bump" all Ladies classes that do not have at least 3 entries into the Ladies Index (and since our ladies classes NEVER have 3 entries, this will reduce all L classes to one class).
    By my quick math this cuts us from 97 classes to 47.

    2. Idea one^^, plus also creating an index for the consistently undersubscribed at the local level Prepared and Modified classes. This combines 11 more open classes into 1 class.
    Now the total is 37.

    3. Idea one and two^^ plus another index class for the also often undersubscribed at the local level Street Prepared and Street Modified classes. That combines 10 more open classes into one and gets us down to 26 total classes.

    So, these three ideas combined cuts the class count from 97 to 26 and doesn't effect the classes typically most highly subscribed at the local level (Street and Street Touring).

    There are options. We just have to be willing to make the call.
    btschafer
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    02 Apr 2015 09:08 AM
    We still need whatever base classes are necessary to support the indexing. This has two implications. First, correct registration is important. The correct base + index class allows the scoring to work. Second, and perhaps most important, we need to get clear on expectations for identifying cars and enforce some reasonable standards. Mis-registered cars cause some confusion and rework, but mis-identified or poorly identified cars are killer.

    We can help here by communicating and enforcing *very* clear car identification requirements. If we need to provide some decent temporary numbers and letters that people can stick on their car then so be it. But trying to decode all of the mostly incorrect variations that people put on their cars is too much work - and too error prone - when we're trying to log something like 600+ runs in a few hours time. And realize that if everything is working properly each car that presents itself to the line gets identified and logged by at least three different people. Include the starter, announcer and corner workers trying to call in penalties "on that red-ish car that finished a minute ago" and we're all of the sudden talking about several thousand independent car identifications. Every one of those identifications has to match exactly or we have serious problems with the computer, the time log, the penalty log, the audit, the announcing, the scoring, etc. If even a very small percentage of those identification events become a problem it adds up in a hurry. In my mind this is what really needs fixing.
    HotDoggin
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    02 Apr 2015 10:03 AM
    One item that you're forgetting -

    JA karts or the likes. I know there will be at least 1 at our events (likely), and that falls out of every category that's been presented. Undersubscribed, unlike any others (can't easily be "grouped") and above all, usually kids.
    tacti
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    02 Apr 2015 10:23 AM
    regards to the car Identifications, if we are completely eliminating individual class and go all pax, can't we just keep using the individual class as the ID? (and not using any SO or STO)

    it shouldn't be too troublesome as long as individual class and pax class does not co-exist?
    Catch-22
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    02 Apr 2015 10:40 AM
    Posted By btschafer on 02 Apr 2015 09:08 AM
    And realize that if everything is working properly each car that presents itself to the line gets identified and logged by at least three different people. Include the starter, announcer and corner workers trying to call in penalties "on that red-ish car that finished a minute ago" and we're all of the sudden talking about several thousand independent car identifications. Every one of those identifications has to match exactly or we have serious problems with the computer, the time log, the penalty log, the audit, the announcing, the scoring, etc. If even a very small percentage of those identification events become a problem it adds up in a hurry. In my mind this is what really needs fixing.

    You forgot to note that when everything starts going wrong, the same folks that put an incorrect or illegible ID on their car are now starting to line up at the trailer to ask about their times or re-runs.  Which turns the mess already going on in the trailer into a wreck, the dominos keep falling, and we're broken.  Again.

    Fewer classes means easier heat and worker management.  Easier guidance of class ID, and less headache in the trailer.  We don't need to pick individual aches and pains out and try to ease the discomfort.  We need to cure the disease.

    Typically you see your highest volume of new people that need guidance at the first ~3 events of the season.  One thing we used to do in Atlanta is print up some 8.5x11 sheets with the classes on them and have someone man a table with class letters, tape, and a rulebook to help rookies get their cars properly registered and ID'd at the early season events each year.  This helped a lot, but when you have 97 classes its still a drop of water in an ocean of issues.  And its not always n00bs that have some sort of dorked up masking tape something on their door.

    This is the sort of stuff that snowballs and makes the day longer for everyone and harder for the folks doing most of the work. 

    JWhitling
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    02 Apr 2015 10:42 AM
    To me it seems that a large part of fixing this problem is via entrant bar coding and scanning at the start line. I imagine that's pretty obvious to the timing and scoring personnel. Are we closer to getting this in place this year? I know it's been an off/on thing, as I remember it.
    obielando
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    02 Apr 2015 09:24 PM
    We have 2 index classes based off experience (Novice and Pro), 5 or whatever on prep level, one on what tires you're using, one on gender, one for the carts, and all the rulebook classes.

    Numbers may not be right, but I think you get where I'm coming from. Coming in as a newbie last year, it was a bit confusing. I feel like having a 'help' table for new people or onlookers to answer classing (or any type, really) questions certainly couldn't hurt.
    obielando
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    08 Apr 2015 08:49 AM
    Posted By Tacti on 02 Apr 2015 10:23 AM
    regards to the car Identifications, if we are completely eliminating individual class and go all pax, can't we just keep using the individual class as the ID? (and not using any SO or STO)

    it shouldn't be too troublesome as long as individual class and pax class does not co-exist?

    I like this concept, but I think due to the software always listing the index first, could make this confusing for T/S, which is honestly really the problem.

     

    I think the ideal solution would be to register for your base class, and have the system auto-choose the index that you need to go in (maybe have a single drop-down with your base classes and a few check boxes for novice, pro and ladies, and then have a decision tree set up to automatically put  you into the appropriate index).

     

    Might be a pipe dream, since I doubt the registration software can handle that - but that would be ideal, if you ask me.


    Also, the analysis I did last year is still out there, if anyone wants the specific entry data for 2014:

    Obie's Analysis based on 2014 entrants

     

    Three registered in PE1 for the Tire index, all 3 of which are in base classes that require street tires.  :)

    lightisfast
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    13 Apr 2015 07:23 PM

    Um, 2 of the 4 people registered are in STR, which aren't allowed in it.  The registration is probably confusing people.  Not even sure how you PAX that since they are no 2015 PAX factors for "stock" class except SSR.  The Tire index made sense when the SCCA classes were all slicks based, but now that common sense prevailed, they work well for local competition.

    ...so at a minimum, kill Tire and use SO?

    trippinbillies40
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    13 Apr 2015 07:30 PM

    Tire index can remain for SP, P, and M cars on street tires, but you're correct, all 4 cars in the current tire index belong elsewhere.  The two STR cars should go to STR or STO, and the two street cars should go to SO.

     

    Honestly, what about creating a class called "I have no effing clue, but here's my car so please move me to where appropriate" and let the admin move them.  That, or add some language on the registration page explaining how the index classes work.  

    lycanthrope
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    13 Apr 2015 11:22 PM
    I've just contacted via email those people who were miss classes and just wrote to them explaining how the classes work and what their options were. the tire index class is a little on the confusing side(i think the name is part of the problem) and I'm not really sure how relevant it is anymore unfortunately. ill start work on something short to explain the classing system on the pre reg but we will see how far that goes. in the mean time ill just keep contacting people and keep a list so i can reclass them at registration if i can't get ahold of them.
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