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Last Post 19 Apr 2016 07:59 AM by  gidtup
Event 2 Feedback, Reverse smacktalk, and video thread
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christoc
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17 Apr 2016 10:06 PM

    Bring it folks: 

    christoc
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    17 Apr 2016 10:44 PM
    Unfortunately I was working, running, or riding with Natalie today, so I didn't get any photos. She did take a few photos during the end of Heat 1, not many competitors, but here are the photos I've uploaded from the event.

    https://www.flickr.com/photos/chamm...4985188423

    gilligan156
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    18 Apr 2016 12:22 AM
    Really fun course, really enjoyed it. The high-power cars seemed to do really well today.

    I'm still adjusting to the Miata, and Bridgestone has still not sent me my tires so I'm still on the Falken all-seaon rubber, but here's my video anyway.

    MINIz guy
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    18 Apr 2016 01:26 AM

     

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b_lGQEPguic

    Nybbler
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    18 Apr 2016 08:58 AM
    My autocross skills are really "rusty". I had a DNF on my first run. It wasn't until someone gave me advice on how to approach the first slalom that I put together a good smooth run, on my fifth run. My last run was fortunately my best, but I was still 6 seconds behind the next best time in my class. I could use the fact that I was still on all-season tires as an excuse, but I know at least 5 seconds could be gained by improving the driver's skill. Unfortunately, I won't be able to make the Evolution School in May, so I don't know how much improvement I'll see over the season.

    Still, I had a great time.
    WaterLogged
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    18 Apr 2016 09:36 AM
    Great course, albeit a rough day for me. Not one clean run of the day. Seriously! I've been away way too long to be trying this hard. I think it's time to go back to the basics.
    DMobeck
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    18 Apr 2016 10:36 AM
    I am so happy to be back racing with you guys after taking most of last year off due to work conflict. I see so many new faces. That is very encouraging. The courses for the first two events have been excellent! The course designers have reallystepped up their game! Assuming that would still be Dean Rhodes and crew unless that has changed while I was gone.
    I would like to mention one item that struck me while working course yesterday. There is much use of blue painter tape for numbers and class letters. Blue tape only shows up easily on white cars. I would ask all others to switch to green or yellow. The more contrast the better for OLD corner captains. Lol
    gilligan156
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    18 Apr 2016 11:43 AM
    Posted By DMobeck on 18 Apr 2016 10:36 AM
    I am so happy to be back racing with you guys after taking most of last year off due to work conflict. I see so many new faces. That is very encouraging. The courses for the first two events have been excellent! The course designers have reallystepped up their game! Assuming that would still be Dean Rhodes and crew unless that has changed while I was gone.
    I would like to mention one item that struck me while working course yesterday. There is much use of blue painter tape for numbers and class letters. Blue tape only shows up easily on white cars. I would ask all others to switch to green or yellow. The more contrast the better for OLD corner captains. Lol

    I kinda wish there was some way we could enforce better number color choice. When corner workers can't read your numbers, that's a problem. For example, I think the most commonly recurring problem is with black numbers on red cars. They do not stand out from the paint well enough. Working timing and scoring, I can not tell you how many times we've had radio calls from corner captains that sound like "+1 on the ... uh ... 91? 97? 61? I don't know, the red car, I couldn't see the class" then we have to try to figure out which car had the cones before confirming the call while also keeping track of anything else that was also on course. This trips up the timing and scoring people who work so hard to keep everything running smoothly. It's frustrating for everyone and completely unnecessary. The numbers are there for you to be quickly and easily identifiable by the stewards, not for you to look cool.

    96SM2
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    18 Apr 2016 12:32 PM

    Is t&s/tech/grid talking to these individuals about the contrast/size/placement issue and they NEED to be corrected? If this is not being communicated to them that there are issues with their numbers, they would assume their solution is working and nothing needs to be corrected. I know we have had a lot of new entrants the first two events, which is great, but that also means we, experienced entrants, need to inform the new entrants of best practices.

    As an fyi, this issue still shows up even at National events but it tends to be the other extreme. People making styling statements with their graphics that are tough to read at speed. Generally, the simpler the font and higher contrast the better for numbers/letters.
    java_osborn
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    18 Apr 2016 12:42 PM

    It was a great course, but man I stunk out loud (I think it was the slaloms) I went from the 40's in event 1 to the 80's in event 2, but it was a fun day and smooth event.  

    I know I talked to several new people and they were all excited for more of the same :).

    So on the numbers conversation, are you talking about this?
    Jeff

    96SM2
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    18 Apr 2016 12:51 PM
    Jeff,
    I can see how that might be confusing, the #1 is of a different color/font/size. The meatball 99 is not a problem for most people I would guess. I know I have said this before, but maybe not here. View the above picture in grey scale on your computer. That is how people with color blind issues tend to see things. So the black against a dark red looks cool in the picture, it looks like very close shades of grey that maybe hard to discern at speed for those color challenged individuals.

     

    edit: Though I am pretty sure that the issues being discussed are a bit more challenging than your picture. : )

    gilligan156
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    18 Apr 2016 01:14 PM
    I wasn't trying to throw shade in any particular direction Jeff, it's just a small issue that has popped up semi-frequently. I can remember having issues with dark gray/gunmetal on black, black numbers on dark blue cars, etc. The black-on-red just seems to be common since it's a popular color combination.

    I can confirm though that the 99/199/991 has caused some confusion for corner captains and T&S, but I don't have a suggestion for you to fix it. (I mean no offense by pointing this out)
    awhittle
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    18 Apr 2016 02:50 PM
    This is Scott in the CRX

    https://youtu.be/3iNdHm81lgs?t=98

    I got the data logging working for speed and acceleration going into the ECU.

    http://www.nbs-stl.com/CRX/CRX%20Autocross%20Trace.png

    and the traction circle...

    http://www.nbs-stl.com/CRX/CRX%20Traction%20Circle.png

    I had a great time but the day got long at 12 hours.

    Andy
    java_osborn
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    18 Apr 2016 03:46 PM
    None taken, I just thought that I have a red car with stickers and wondered how it ranked on the "I can't see the number" scale.

    I could maybe get a bigger white one, but unfortunately that can't fix the dyslexia that comes with the 99/199/991. All I can do is make sure we change the numbers first thing out of the car, so that at least they will be correct, on both sides of the car :) LOL

    Jeff
    christoc
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    18 Apr 2016 03:47 PM
    Posted By java_osborn on 18 Apr 2016 03:46 PM
    None taken, I just thought that I have a red car with stickers and wondered how it ranked on the "I can't see the number" scale.

    I could maybe get a bigger white one, but unfortunately that can't fix the dyslexia that comes with the 99/199/991. All I can do is make sure we change the numbers first thing out of the car, so that at least they will be correct, on both sides of the car :) LOL

    Jeff

    You could just follow the two driver car standard of 99/199 and call it a day

    gilligan156
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    18 Apr 2016 03:57 PM
    Throwing some white 9s in the meatball, and then maybe a white "1" magnet to throw on for the co-driver, would increase visibility pretty well provided you don't hate how it looks...

    Terrible 2 second photoshop

    gidtup
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    19 Apr 2016 07:59 AM
    The rule for numbers is in the St. Louis Supplemental Regulations:

    8.3 Vehicle Identification, (SR 3.7) & (Vehicle Identification Appendix F in the SR)
    A. All vehicles must display numbers and class letters on both sides, which must be readable by Timing & Scoring, Course, and Grid at all times. Sponsor stickers may be required. If they are, they must be on to pass tech.
    B. Only one set of numbers and class letters may be visible while the vehicle is running.
    C. Class shall be represented by the upper-case abbreviated form rather than be spelled out. Ladies classes shall be indicated by the letter “L” following the class letters. (Example: “BSPL” instead of “B Street Prepared Ladies”).
    D. Numbers and class letters should be positioned next to each other. All letters and numbers must be on body panels, not on windows. All numbers and class letters must use the same typeface and the same color, and this color must provide adequate contrast to the background color.
    E. Numbers must be a minimum of 8" high with a 1.25" stroke. Class letters must be a minimum of 4" high with a 0.75" stroke. In all cases, the height of the class letters must be between 25% and 75% of the height of the numbers. Stroke width must be at least 10% of the height.
    F. The “1” on two-driver cars and the “L” on Ladies class cars are subject to all of the above requirements with regard to placement, color, size, and stroke.
    G. Karts may use numbers and class letters of reduced size provided that the following conditions are met:
    1) Numbers must be displayed on the front and rear in addition to both sides;
    2) Class letters must be on both sides;
    3) In no case may the numbers be smaller than 6" in height with 3/4" stroke, using a high- contrast color and background.
    H. Novices will run with the letter "N" on the side of their car.
    8.4 Car Numbers:
    Numbers 21 through 999 are allowed. Car numbers will be issued on a first-come, first-served basis in each class. If desired, drivers of the same car but in different classes (open and ladies) may use the same car number. If a second driver enters later he/she must inform the registrar of the additional driver to ensure correct number assignment. No zeroes can be used as the first number on a car (e.g. 06, 006, 016).

    Each driver of a two-driver car may run any available number. To easily allow for multiple co-drivers during the season, the numbers 101-199 are only available as an option to the second driver of a two-driver car. If this option is chosen, the second driver must use the same number as the first driver plus 100 (e.g. 8 and 108, 66 and 166). These numbers cannot be made any driver's permanent number.
    Numbers 1-20 are reserved for the previous season's Top 20 Index Drivers.
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