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Last Post 13 Sep 2010 06:17 PM by  Foglght
A towing quandry
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Foglght
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25 Aug 2010 08:24 PM

    So, I have choices, I just don't know which one to make.

    1. Buy a class A motorhome (or class C), and purchase an 18' enclosed trailer for all the stuff. Car is 2,700lbs. Buy a different DD.

    2. Buy a 5'th wheel toy hauler (found a few that will fit a car), and a 3,500 used truck. Use truck as DD.

    My one problem with option 2 is the towing capacity of a 3500. Max on a brand new dodge ram 3500 diesel 2wd is 14,400lbs. The 5'th wheel unloaded (dry) is 10,500lbs. Add a car, tools, tires, etc etc and we are talking right at the limit when you figure water weights on the trailer. Some discussion was had about whether or not the 5'th wheel has a different calculation about towing weight, but I'm not buying that yet.

    Anyone use either of these options? I'll use it for camping and racing. Needs to fit 2 adults, 2 kids, and 2 dogs.

    snaponbob
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    25 Aug 2010 08:52 PM
    Depends on your budget. A gas motorhome with sliders is a wonder to behold. Diesel is so damn expensive that the mileage/cost calculation matters. Be careful about motorhome towing capacity - research it. As for a Dodge (or Chevy or Ford) diesel, I see them towing incredible loads (a lot more than 7 tons - a friend has a 1/4 million mile 7.4 Ford 1 ton p/u and hauls over 15k plenty). But a 7800 pound 1 ton p/u doesn't sound like a fun DD, does it? Frankly, I would love to have a 32-35' class A and a semi beater for a DD.
    Dave Hardy
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    26 Aug 2010 06:06 AM
    Foglght wrote:

    So, I have choices, I just don't know which one to make.

    1. Buy a class A motorhome (or class C), and purchase an 18' enclosed trailer for all the stuff. Car is 2,700lbs. Buy a different DD.

    2. Buy a 5'th wheel toy hauler (found a few that will fit a car), and a 3,500 used truck. Use truck as DD.

    My one problem with option 2 is the towing capacity of a 3500. Max on a brand new dodge ram 3500 diesel 2wd is 14,400lbs. The 5'th wheel unloaded (dry) is 10,500lbs. Add a car, tools, tires, etc etc and we are talking right at the limit when you figure water weights on the trailer. Some discussion was had about whether or not the 5'th wheel has a different calculation about towing weight, but I'm not buying that yet.

    Anyone use either of these options? I'll use it for camping and racing. Needs to fit 2 adults, 2 kids, and 2 dogs.

    You are typically going to be limited to towing 10,000# off of the bumper, by the hitch itself. A class V hitch will get you up to 14,000 off the bumper. A new 2500HD will let you pull 17,200# with a 5th wheel. Stepping up to the 3500 gets you 21,500# with the 5th wheel.

    Regardless of the ratings, there's no way I'd want to pull 5 tons off the bumper. For big loads, a 5th wheel just makes so much more sense.

    All that said, I also wouldn't want to daily drive something that could tow 10 tons. I have a 2500HD that sits in the driveway 320 days a year, and I use a WRX to commute. Keeps miles off of the truck, and lets me not have to deal with daily driving a bigass truck.

    snaponbob
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    26 Aug 2010 06:47 AM
    A friend has been towing a 20" box trailer and often has a Mini in it. The tow vehicle is a 1/2 or 3/4 tone 5.7 hemi Dodge p/u. The Dodge works sort of hard pulling it. A month ago he purchased a 10 year old class A 32' motor home with a Vortec 454 Chevy. Barely breaks a sweat hauling that same load. And the storage under the floor is endless.
    Foglght
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    26 Aug 2010 07:10 AM
    DILYSI Dave wrote:
    [You are typically going to be limited to towing 10,000# off of the bumper, by the hitch itself. A class V hitch will get you up to 14,000 off the bumper. A new 2500HD will let you pull 17,200# with a 5th wheel. Stepping up to the 3500 gets you 21,500# with the 5th wheel.

    Regardless of the ratings, there's no way I'd want to pull 5 tons off the bumper. For big loads, a 5th wheel just makes so much more sense.

    All that said, I also wouldn't want to daily drive something that could tow 10 tons. I have a 2500HD that sits in the driveway 320 days a year, and I use a WRX to commute. Keeps miles off of the truck, and lets me not have to deal with daily driving a bigass truck.

    I can't find anywhere saying that using a 5'th wheel ups the tow rating. I need to see that in writing somewhere. I would much rather purchase a 5'th wheel and get a hemi truck 2500.

    Had no intentions of bumper pulling anything. A long time ago, I had a 3500 dually that towed a 26' enclosed with a 3,600lb. car, golf cart, and all the tools......along with 3 sets of tires/rims in the bed. Yeah, it knew the weight was there, but didn't matter much.

    marka
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    26 Aug 2010 07:49 AM

    Howdy,

    Foglght wrote:

    So, I have choices, I just don't know which one to make.

    1. Buy a class A motorhome (or class C), and purchase an 18' enclosed trailer for all the stuff. Car is 2,700lbs. Buy a different DD.

    I don't know of a single class C motorhome that's rated to pull the 6k-ish (and probably more like 7k) lbs that takes. You can probably get there with a super-c, but when I was looking the Kodiak based ones weren't rated for it either. Gas class A's weren't any better. We needed to go to a diesel pusher class A as the cheapest option rated to pull our 24' enclosed w/camaro (9k-ish lbs). The International based Super C's would also do it, but they're all new enough that it was too expensive to go that way.

    Edit: This has nothing at all to do with what the hitch says its rated for, and everything to do with GVWR, loaded weight ready to live in minus the trailer, GCWR, and axle weights. You also need to pay attention in the class C's to the frame extensions and how well they're constructed.

    [quote]

    2. Buy a 5'th wheel toy hauler (found a few that will fit a car), and a 3,500 used truck. Use truck as DD.

    My one problem with option 2 is the towing capacity of a 3500. Max on a brand new dodge ram 3500 diesel 2wd is 14,400lbs. The 5'th wheel unloaded (dry) is 10,500lbs. Add a car, tools, tires, etc etc and we are talking right at the limit when you figure water weights on the trailer. Some discussion was had about whether or not the 5'th wheel has a different calculation about towing weight, but I'm not buying that yet.

    Anyone use either of these options? I'll use it for camping and racing. Needs to fit 2 adults, 2 kids, and 2 dogs.

    I didn't hear good reports on the toy haulers that can fit a car actually being able to deal with a car well, but perhaps there were some I didn't look at closely enough. Plus, you've got your (smelly) racing crap in your living space.

    Race trailers with living quarters help with that, but those don't tend to have the nice features like slide-outs which make a HUGE difference in usable space.

    Another point... Any motorhome is going to be way more of a PITA maint wise compared to a 3500 truck. The truck can go to just about any mechanic without issues. The motorhome, particularly one on a real chassis with air suspension/brakes/etc/etc has a much more limited pool of folks willing to work on it.

    I currently have a '99 Newmar DutchStar 38' diesel pusher. If I were doing it again, I'd have to look really hard at if the tradeoffs in lower quality living stuff in the standard big fifth wheel race trailer with living quarters was worth the 'less hassle'. I'm guessing that they wouldn't be, but it'd be close.

    Mark

    kb_solo2
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    26 Aug 2010 09:01 AM

    we have this . great trailer, tows fine and handles the weight. Pick your garage length based on your application...

    Towed it with a 3500 Dodge Cummins for 2 years, then upgraded to a Kodiak.

    jdchristianson
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    26 Aug 2010 05:10 PM

    I work in a Ford/Chevy dealership, and both of the manufactures towing guides list higher weights for 5th wheel towing. It puts the weight on the chassis much better and allows the truck to survive.

    There has also been some discussion on these forums about toy haulers. I think you should be careful because most of them don't have a very high payload capacity. A car hauler with living space is going to be a much stronger trailer.

    Jeff Christianson

    Foglght
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    26 Aug 2010 06:26 PM
    jdchristianson wrote:

    I work in a Ford/Chevy dealership, and both of the manufactures towing guides list higher weights for 5th wheel towing. It puts the weight on the chassis much better and allows the truck to survive.

    There has also been some discussion on these forums about toy haulers. I think you should be careful because most of them don't have a very high payload capacity. A car hauler with living space is going to be a much stronger trailer.

    Jeff Christianson

    Looking at this:

    http://www.forestriverinc.com/nd/de...s=WnPStdFW

    Looks like a pretty good deal on one right now. I've given up on the idea of a motorcoach. Now, the next question:

    Which tow vehicle? I need a 3500 4-door diesel dually pickup.

    Joe_914
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    27 Aug 2010 08:40 AM

    I've been looking at the Forrest river Work/play trailers. I agree with real car trailer with living quarters.

    I use my big ass truck everyday just because I LOVE it.

    jdchristianson
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    12 Sep 2010 02:38 PM

    I saw a number of toy haulers in use at Nationals, I'd like to hear what folks like and dislike. I've been browsing the Work and Play by Forrest River as well, anyone have one? Looks like I'd be giving up towing with my 1/2 ton truck, they weigh over 8500lbs.

    Jeff Christianson

    Foglght
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    12 Sep 2010 04:58 PM

    I'm working with a dealer right now to order a 5'th wheel (I think) for a wpf38sb. 22' garage, with queen bed, and two bunks. Also, has a fuel station so I don't have to carry around fuel jugs anymore. 28 gallon thing too!

    I haven't heard anything bad about them so far. Its basically made on a cargo trailer chassis.

    Still have yet to hear a price. Hope I'm not in for sticker shock.

    Dave Hardy
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    13 Sep 2010 08:35 AM
    Foglght wrote:
    DILYSI Dave wrote:
    [You are typically going to be limited to towing 10,000# off of the bumper, by the hitch itself. A class V hitch will get you up to 14,000 off the bumper. A new 2500HD will let you pull 17,200# with a 5th wheel. Stepping up to the 3500 gets you 21,500# with the 5th wheel.

    Regardless of the ratings, there's no way I'd want to pull 5 tons off the bumper. For big loads, a 5th wheel just makes so much more sense.

    All that said, I also wouldn't want to daily drive something that could tow 10 tons. I have a 2500HD that sits in the driveway 320 days a year, and I use a WRX to commute. Keeps miles off of the truck, and lets me not have to deal with daily driving a bigass truck.

    I can't find anywhere saying that using a 5'th wheel ups the tow rating. I need to see that in writing somewhere. I would much rather purchase a 5'th wheel and get a hemi truck 2500.

    Had no intentions of bumper pulling anything. A long time ago, I had a 3500 dually that towed a 26' enclosed with a 3,600lb. car, golf cart, and all the tools......along with 3 sets of tires/rims in the bed. Yeah, it knew the weight was there, but didn't matter much.

    http://www.chevrolet.com/assets/pdf...051310.pdf

    EWCMR2
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    13 Sep 2010 06:11 PM
    Don't forget to check out the loading height of the toyboxes. Most of them are much higher than race trailers, requiring really long loading ramps...
    Foglght
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    13 Sep 2010 06:17 PM

    The forest river one has a loading ramp door.

    I am trading in my car, and putting a down payment on the 5'th wheel one tomorrow.

    Tis a wpf38sb

    Looking forward to getting back into racing now.

    Wait........now I need a truck to tow it with!!! Crap.

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